WildConcept6

@Kilamanjaro what I've really noticed is that the big issue is with western publishers, specifically EA and Ubisoft and the likes, who want to push everyone to their own launcher (for data collection reasons and to make more money from sales). The types that wouldn't support steam if it wasn't so big. But it's been fantastic for me with indies and JRPGs. I have a legion go and it's been perfect for Metaphor, Persona, Yakuza, Octopath Traveler, Sea of Stars, and the likes. Those are also some of my favorite games so it works out fantastically.

Only mentioned GTA because I genuinely think that most non-GTAs can benefit from it, but it's a matter of making it known to gamers who then push for it. I'm hoping that the Xbox Full Screen mode does that. But I'm also hoping that the more prestigious titles in the program does that. Xbox now has secured both Hollow Knight Silksong and COD for XPA. First party in general now has a blockbuster output of guaranteed XPA games which also includes Bethesda and ABK.

@smoreon I find the implication that "complexity" is the issue interesting when the games with some of the worst performance have been remasters and remakes that didn't change anything design wise. Developers aren't without fault and I'm not some "game engine critique guru" but if nothing else the issue isn't that simple. Like we can probably say on a pretty basic level that game development has always been difficult and developers have always had to struggle with multiple hardware SKUs. These aren't new problems and UE5 always should've been designed with these upcoming updates to help ease these issues. We could also say the current problems with UE5 games go beyond the engine and speak more to the game development process in today's landscape (rushed with a focus on trying to deliver every feature known to man and having ultra realistic graphics) causes more issues that just UE5. We could say it's a combination of things and so on. It just rubs me the wrong way massively that Sweeney would even choose to blame a couple of specific things and drive the conversation away from their engine entirely.

Optimization is an issue and developers and publishers need to come down to earth. There's a LOT of issues with game development right now. But Epic cannot, CANNOT, pass the blame. I'm tired of all this scapegoating from everyone in the industry. Pull up your britches, take some responsibility, and make the necessary improvements.

If that's what they're doing then great. Hopefully these changes amount to something. But they still shouldn't be trying to pass the blame or put on a "holier than thou" routine.

@Kilamanjaro Lots of reasons
1) Not every game is GTA. Most people don't buy most games twice for full price. In this case realistically not much money is being lost.
2) Xbox is reporting, and people will comment and say, that gamers on Xbox are buying XPA games at a higher rate than non-XPA games. So going back to point one, if you're game isn't GTA and people aren't going to buy it twice, it's just purely profitable to utilize a program that leads to increased sales.
3) Most games, especially those like GTA, make the majority of their money through Microtransactions these days. Regardless of if you buy multiple copies of a game, you're only realistically going to play on one version at any given time and likely to only buy Microtransactions on that version. Xbox also reports higher player engagement & retention on Xbox Play Anywhere titles and for live service and Microtransactions heavy games those are both the two most important metrics. People playing your game more increases the spending they do in-game.
4) XPA isn't that difficult to develop for (Microsoft does a lot to make it really easy) and developers are already developing for many different types of hardware just on account of building games for PC. Plus as a benefit games get cross save features which just add value and means they don't have to set them up themselves (it seems like a small thing, but it isn't and not everyone wants to put in the money to maintain it like Ubisoft).
5) Larger communities (and again engagement is huge for games these days)

You know, Xbox Play Anywhere isn't even that big of a deal. It's no different from say buying a book and taking that book and reading it anywhere. Or like for gaming it's the same as buying a game on literally any PC storefront. In which case you can then access that game on no matter what PC hardware you use. It's even more similar with handheld PCs and the Steam Deck existing. We've just let console gaming create these walled gardens around every game we "own" and now we're used to that.

1) Games like Eden's Zero that launch XPA with Cloud Gaming Support (stream your own library) is literally my holy grail. That's all I ever wanted. This needs to be every game.

2) Unfortunately, a lot of publishers, especially western publishers, want gamers to use their proprietary storefronts. They wouldn't support Steam if they didn't have to for sales. So there's the answer btw. Xbox Play Anywhere won't really hit mainstream until gamers show that it's worth it (that we buy more XPA games and spend more money in them). Which granted Xbox is pushing that narrative now and it does seem to be working with more XPA games than before. But it's still an issue.

3) All that said, it's actually massive that Hollow Knight Silksong (indie GTA according to other indie devs) and COD are both launching XPA. COD being first party and XPA is probably the best get for Xbox to train and market that program more.

@Millionski They would have to be MAGICIANS to pull that off with the next Xbox console coming in 1 to 2 years. They've already promised full backwards compatibility and that isn't currently possible with the Xbox PC App. Even if they could pull it off on a technical level, there's still the massive licensing issues.

I think we've already been shown reality with the premature "this is an Xbox" campaign. Xbox's biggest competitive advantage is its larger ecosystem. They clearly want that to be a big selling point for the Xbox brand and get gamers at any possible entry point. On PC they're taking windows gaming, the largest gaming platform like period, and unifying the user experience under an Xbox language. They're also continuing to do this on the cloud. On all platforms (Cloud, Console, and PC) the UX design is kept consistent. They want it to be easy to reach any gamer in any market and fold them into the same Xbox ecosystem. They also want to make that their value proposition and continue pushing with stuff like Xbox Play Anywhere.

I think the Next Xbox console will still feel like a traditional console, but there will be a much greater focus under the hood for bringing everything (cloud, console, and PC) in line and feeling like a ubiquitous ecosystem. XPA will probably continue to be pushed hard and the AMD partnership will probably lead to it being easier than ever to develop for Xbox Play Anywhere (if not near automatic). We'll also probably see more Xbox PCs and Microsoft will start rolling the software out to all windows devices that want to use it. They want to build a gaming empire for Xbox. Right now there's no reason to nuke the console territory because console gamers are still paying oogles of money and consoles are still profitable. The issue is growth and increasing profits, and that's where a wider ecosystem that reaches more gamers on all platforms comes in.

I don't think it's controversial anymore to say that generations are dead and that the console market has hit maturity. Console gamers are still incredibly profitable (in fact they are spending more on Xbox & PS), but they aren't growing in number. As a result, I just think "Next Gen" is more of a vision of an evolution of the entire ecosystem for Xbox, and not a single major hardware boost. I don't expect them to overhaul everything just yet because I don't think they have the capabilities to do so AND hold on to the consumer base they've built that gives them a lot of money.

Like for right now, I see this Xbox OEM as two things 1) Microsoft unifying all gaming efforts on all platforms under "Xbox" branding 2) Microsoft finally improving gaming on windows after being asked too for longer than Xbox has existed (probably due in part to Valve selling SteamOS licenses). In other words, Microsoft is using its competitive advantages in multiple gaming markets to build an ecosystem that crosses both and benefits them more through starting to unify efforts. Windows as a gaming platform will 100% outlive Xbox (it'll outlive PS and Nintendo too), but I don't think we're there yet. Maybe the box after the next box

I just want to see Xbox present in Japan connecting with gamers. I went to TGS last year and Xbox had games there (Indiana Jones had a MASSIVE presence) and branding beats with like Mechabreak, but Xbox still wasn't there itself. Not like Sony. And they didn't have the built-up nostalgia in Japan like Nintendo. Xbox is virtually unknown by gamers in Japan and nonexistent as a result. We'll really start to see more Japanese publisher and dev support come naturally and consistently with every game, when Xbox is a well known platform that has at least a modest userbase in Japan.

@Kaloudz "not optimistic" is being kind. I'm quite certain the issue will only get worse. Publishers have been pushing the envelope ever since they figured out they could update games post release.

@Vaako007 1) My first comment is precisely about how Sony will have to decide whether its worth it to limit their IPs value & game success over potentially losing Playstation Users. What's important there is if gamers are switching over losing exclusives. But the IP will only ever make more money and be better manged on more platforms.
2) Nintendo doesn't belong in this conversation because of investors. Nintendo is a smaller company whose investors are fine with smaller numbers in raw financials.
3) Though speaking of Nintendo Pokémon is an excellent example. The IP is only as big as it is due to a multimedia approach which involves everything entertainment related and even beyond. That's what better managing IP means. And sure, if Sony can monetize any IP half as much as Nintendo managed with Pokemon then exclusives wouldn't be going away.
4) So this means Sony will probably port Spider-Man next and Wolverine excatly? As those Spider-Man 2 margins were dummy thin and those are all IP that Sony doesn't.

What are we really doing? I mean I'm pretty confused by the comment. Is the suggestion that Sony doesn't have investors? Do Sony's investors not want more money? Are we saying that making IP bigger is making it less valuable? Because the very idea of exclusives is limiting the audience of your game in hopes of increasing the audience of your platform. The console is very important to Sony, but that's why the reason why this is an incredibly important time for them. Its why they've already done PC ports and why they've spent so much trying to shift into live service. Sony is in a lot of danger beause they built up everything around a market that's just not seeing as many new users. And PlayStation specifically put a lot of money into investing in their cinematic narrative video games which have increasingly small profit margins. A solution is more releases all at once. That is a solution and all I'm saying is its clearly one that's being discussed at Sony.

@Kaloudz Early access too just feels like a bit of a graveyard. It's like a stealth way for a AAA publisher especially to say they aren't confident in a game and can shut it down and give up at anyone moment.

Definitely the higher beta testing rollout you start to see ahead of a full release. I imagine they'll be looking at costs, queue times, traffic, and anything else related to pricing. Hopefully next we start seeing the rumored quality updates.

The big standout for me is the PC games addition. Xbox talked about PC games for streaming EONS ago. I had thought they'd given up. And with this everything we were promised about XCloud is there to some capacity: we have mouse & keyboard, owned games, and PC games in addition to the game pass console library.

Edit - Oops. Looks like I misread. They're adding native PC titles to the Core and Standard tier, not streaming PC titles. Rather interesting though. How do they reconcile having PC Game Pass AND including PC titles on every tier? At the very least PC game pass is probably getting a price increase then since it still has day one games and ea play.

@GamerScore200K idk. This gen hasn't given me the most confidence in any game's performance. And a non zero number of them have been re-releases that ran better on older hardware or through the backwards compatibility program. Like GTA.

This is the data Xbox talked about following the first wave of Playstation ports: they didn't just see the influx of PS gamers, they saw increased engagement (and in game spending) from Xbox & PC gamers. The vocal minority can be as loud as they want, but real numbers show that everyone wants games which are more populated and can be more easily played with their friends.

Once these numbers start rolling in for Sony, I don't think they can keep a lid on multiplatform games. They're a public stock company. Investors will see this data and wonder why every Sony game isn't multiplatform. And there's only so far the exclusivity and brand power argument will only go so far.

I think a big argument probably happening at Sony now (and that has probably already happened at Microsoft) is how much money is being lost (and money that could've been earned but wasn't counts as a loss) vs how many users were acquired as a result of a game being exclusive. Take marketing for example. Market budgets are becoming increasingly expensive and Sony spends a lot on marketing for Playstation exclusives, but how many new users is Playstation getting these days? Per dollar spent on marketing how much value does that generate for Sony as a business? Another question would be, how much is Sony losing in potential sales by not maximizing their marketing budget through simultaneous releases? Staggered launches mean staggered marketing which costs money each time or they'd have to skimp on marketing and just hope word of mount is good enough. That costs money especially when games just get ported later anyway. And even for single player games, more buzz and interest is generated when more people can enjoy the game from launch leading to more sales overall.

We already know that no console is acquiring or converting new users like they used to. Do the question then becomes, how much is keeping users worth? And increasingly we're seeing that it doesn't actually cost much at all to keep users. And there continues to be data to back up that multiplatform launches lead to increased user engagement on all platforms. Looking at stuff like Sony's Spider-Man 2 margins, I just don't think exclusives are terribly long for this world. They'll get to a point of PC day & date and then they'll see that gamers are switching and look at this Helldivers 2 data and start porting more and then more. Then they'll see that PS gamers still aren't switching and their games are making more than ever and start releasing everywhere day one to maximizing profits.

@Kaloudz And what I can't help but notice is how many of these games are from AAA publishers. Indie games needing feedback and some money to get past the finish line, sure. But an EA game? Umm, okay, thanks for wanting our feedback I guess?

And like it sound fine in theory for a live service game, but also companies have proven that they can drastically change fully released games through updates anyway. Like why can't EA release a full game AND THEN adjust the live service aspects through updates based on feedback? This is a reboot of one of their most popular older games. I just think it deserves a full polished release and not an early access tag. Especially with gamers probably still being asked to spend money on Microtransactions during the Early access period.

Not the first comment of this nature I've seen, but like another indie dev (for Aeterna Lucis) was super kind and respectful and, more importantly, they positioned Silk Song as an opportunity for them to focus on polishing their game. Honestly it was just a stealth delay that they could make look good. It was smart. That's to say, it didn't come off like whinny man children. This is your job for God's sake. It comes with self publishing or being a publisher. Stuff happens. Grow up and deal with it. And it sounds harsh but this is LITERALLY IN THE JOB DESCRIPTION. You as a company (independent or otherwise) should NEVER be in a position where one freak crisis event tanks you. The world has been terrible this past several years. That's a lesson that should be ingrained in every game publisher now. Crisis management plans ARE NOT A JOKE. Be it tarrifs or violent conflicts or pandemics or global shortages or shadow drops, you shouldn't, as people doing business, ever allow yourself to be in a position that something like this is a huge problem (at least big enough that you b**** about it only). Actually, even if it is a problem don't freaking complain about it openly online. Like wtf is wrong with you? Who raised you? That's not even a business tactic, that's common human social skills. Complain about it to your friends and co-workers (your team) IRL. Don't ever post that crap online unless you want the heat (which hey, rage baiting is an effective marketing tactic for short term engagement (but it's far better for word of mouth than it is for sales)).

@YungCizzle24 *12 and counting. The big AAA are "starting" to drop support. But They probably won't all drop Xbox One until 2026 (or maybe even 2027). And there's still the possibility for ports like Jedi Survivor. And I don't see most AA or indie (or in general games that aren't that demanding) games dropping Xbox One until like next decade.

The idea of a pro model this Gen is such a joke. The PS5 Pro has yet to show the significant gains over the PS5 that justifies the massive price increase (taking into account base prices before tarrifs) for an all digital console.

That's to say, yeah man, we still haven't fully utilized the base generation consoles. All of them are fantastic. Even the Series S has a lot more kick to it than most devs are getting out from it. Games just ARE NOT being optimized these days and that's on all platforms. It's gotten even worse on PC.

I think the next gen Xbox does need to come sooner rather than later, but only because the next gen Xbox will be the center of an evolving ecosystem. Hardware wise I'd say we could coast off the Series X for another five years. However, Xbox is at an important juncture in their plans that've honestly been on display since XPA was first announced nearly 10 years ago. New Xbox consoles need to come to build out that unified ecosystem they want. Maybe they'll be the full hybrid PC or maybe they'll utilize the AMD partnership to help make Xbox Play Anywhere development easy, if not automatic.

That's to say, he's right in that people can and will be happy with the Series X for a long time to come. I think hardware wise generations are dead. But for Xbox specifically next gen is far more than just a traditional hardware evolution and however the ecosystem evolves it won't really start until we have new consoles to sit at the center.

Tbh I don't mind it being Gears of War Ultimate V2. I bought ultimate but never got around to playing it, so now I'm sitting on a free copy of a new remaster of a game that's also new to me.

@TacoSlayer1089 You'll be able to open any other platform, store, or app on PC without leaving the Xbox Full Screen experience. That's the best thing about it. We don't have to wait for Microsoft and other companies to be buddy buddy and integrate features. It's just a new user experience on top of windows that turns the unnecessary crap off and is more gaming friendly.

And just clarifying this particular post is about the Xbox App piloting an insider update that adds other apps to the Xbox App library. The goal from Microsoft here is just to make it as easy as possible to access everything gaming related on a Windows Gaming device through the Xbox App and eventually full screen experience. You won't be STUCK in Microsoft's app or STUCK using Microsoft's services waiting for integration. You'll simply be able to boot into a windows mode that's more optimized for gaming (uses less resources for the OS) and has a far better interface focused on gaming.

@themightyant It wouldn't have full Xbox compatibility, but once the Xbox Full screen mode is pushed out across windows devices via the Xbox app, you could build your own solid PC, put it under your TV, and call it a day. (if you just want to access all PC stores in the ROG Ally Xbox user interface and with its features).

I never needed any convincing. I already own a Lenovo Legion Go and a Steam Deck. I'd sell my Steam Deck and buy the ROG as my secondary if I could get back the full $600 I spent but it's an LCD model and I doubt that I could. Otherwise the economy is too f***ed up right now and the Z2E doesn't look to offer enough gains over the Z1E for me to justify upgrading. I'd also really want a trackpad. I am certainly even more hyped by the Xbox Full screen mode debuting with this device, but that was always what was most attractive to me. And that will also be eventually going to all devices.

@ILuvGames @Scummbuddy There's a 20 something gig pre-install available on Xbox. Can't say I'm well versed in the semantics around "pre-load" and "pre-install" in the gaming community. I just know that there's 22.3 GB of "Helldivers 2" installed on my expansion card, and I assume that's different from the 432.4 MB of "Digimon Story Time Stranger" I also have installed.

Already pre-installed ready to go.

@InheritNegative They don't want you to camp outside stores anymore 😢 (or like make a pillow fort in your living room I guess)

I find this very interesting as a none MGS fan because my first exposure to a review before this was Digital foundry and the game seems to be struggling in the frame rate department a lot and some performance issues. Interesting because I remember the reception to Oblivion being the same despite similar performance issues. I guess it's because it's a remake, but I'm also wondering if people just don't care about frame rate anymore (when that was kinda what kickstsrted this gen).

@HeavyHoggJP If that's your ultimatum then why wait? It's really only rumors we have. For all we know this could be it in terms of "supporting multiple storefronts" and it exists now. Next gen is 1-3 years away (most likely 2027) and we don't fully know what exactly the Next Gen Xbox will support, to what extent, how it will be priced, or literally anything. If you're just interested in having a PC experience, then you can get all that right now and KNOW what you're getting. And the Xbox Full Screen experience will eventually roll out to all windows devices. (the update on this post is available right now for the Xbox App for Xbox insiders). Plus if you're just looking for a steam console experience then there's cheaper options with stuff like the Steam Deck.

@kmtrain83 I feel like business wise it'll be the same for all OEMs. Microsoft will get the windows licensing fees (maybe Xbox branding fees now too) and then really just make money on the software. And ASUS will make money from hardware sales.

I'd be surprised to see PS license out for OEMs. Microsoft is doing it because it's been Windows' bread and butter for eons. This isn't that different than any other windows PC handheld conceptually. All MS had to do is collaborate a bit more on optimizing the experience on the OS side.

@Millionski I lean towards the same. People will point to not every Xbox game on Console being on this device (or Xbox PCs), but not every Xbox game natively available on the Xbox PC launcher is available on Xbox Consoles. They don't need complete and total compatibility. Effort just needs to be put in and Microsoft needs to make sure they don't leave behind either platform. Moving forward I'd say XPA HAS to become the standard, but otherwise the next first party console supporting backwards compatibility and not these Xbox PC OEMs is more than fine.

@NCGhostOfLOWERD Oh I fully expect it down the line. I feel like Microsoft will start "encouraging" all gaming OEMs to ship with this Xbox Full Screen mode on by default. The Xbox App is already pre-installed on windows. And we'll probably see more Xbox branded PCs in general.

@Weebleman the Z1E handhelds in general should hold up great. For another year or two. They should definitely have more power than the base model Xbox Ally.

I love the messaging and that Xbox is making a better, more consistent effort to be present at all these events. It's not just Xbox Games Show/e3 or bust anymore.

Looking forward to Xbox having a physical presence at Tokyo Game Show this year, but of course it has to be this year and not last year when I went 😭😭😭.

@Ricky-Spanish Oh, man. I love the Lego games. You're in for a treat. Highly recommend the Lego Stars Skywalker Saga if you see it on sale and end up really enjoying this Batman one.

@BAMozzy yeah there's other obvious ones to bring up like all the free games (Amazon prime gives away so many I feel like a criminal), humble bundles, competition between storefronts, and whatever. But the big thing I want to add is that the last I checked PS and Nintendo don't even give cloud saves with a sub. That's always been wild to me. All consoles also have limited access to games (compared to PC). And you couldn't exactly make a productivity setup for consoles to do work or download mods or anything. They're less subsidized dedicated hardware. But when you buy a console you also pay in the cost of the walled garden

I was gonna say the rumor is eh, but I can believe them waiting until nearly the last possible moment to settle on pricing. There's been way too many price increases this past year for people to be okay with a new product changing it's price during pre-order. And they'll have to see what happens with the tarrifs. While also maybe trying to price this competitively.

@Ricky-Spanish First time?

No, this seriously looks fire. And I just want it to be good after the last round of DC games...

@HeavyHoggJP I mean, just to be clear all Microsoft is doing here is updating the Xbox app to do what community made apps have been doing for Eons. Like Playnite already exists. And so many others. They aren't fundamentally changing the capability of windows or adding new features or getting new support from other companies. If Microsoft does indeed plan this and "steam on Xbox" as rumors suggest then it'd be a MUCH bigger undertaking.

The verdict to me seems like hardware wise it's not a massive upgrade over the Z1E handhelds, which I think we'd gotten benchmarks to say already (that the Z2E isn't a huge leap). And the Z2A should be below the Z1E. It sounds like a better buy as your first handheld (though the current pricing says otherwise (these "global market conditions" can't be making companies too happy)).

Software wise this is basically revolutionary as far as Windows gaming goes. I see this as a showcase shell with the Xbox Full screen mode being the real star of the show, and she'll be arriving at a lot more shows overtime. This is an optimized solid hardware device that is here to flex it's muscles and get people talking. This is Xbox's first real push into actually competing in the PC gaming space since they launched their launcher ages ago. And it's Microsoft's first time giving a darn about competing as a PC gaming platform in like ever. Thank you to Vavle for waking Microsoft tf up. I truly cannot wait to see how this Xbox Full Screen mode evolves (potentially how other departments at Windows use it "cough give me a table mode for the surface pro cough"). And I can't wait to see it get pushed out to more devices. Up until now any attempt to do something like this on windows meant using a lot of workarounds and community applications or straight up uninstalling windows.

I really wanted to add that it feels a bit understated what Xbox is doing. What Microsoft is doing really. Windows is the biggest gaming platform aside from like Android mobile gaming. It's the ultimate platform in terms of gaming support too. Microsoft is 1) finally doing what gamers have always asked for and optimizing gaming for windows and 2) doing it all through the Xbox brand and experience. And if the Xbox app is pre-installed and Microsoft tells OEMs for gaming machines to turn this on by default or even just prompts users a ton or it just works really well and it spreads as a must use for windows gaming, then in one move the Xbox App goes from being the laughing stock of PC launchers to encompassing the entire experience. And competitors and watchdogs can't get mad if this experience gives full freedom to easily access other storefronts and applications. This is actually impressive. I think Microsoft shouldnt have taken this long to do it (like Valve beating them to the punch is embarrassing), but it's still a good move overall. And it's a good chance for the Xbox PC launcher to experience actual growth. They'll get to nudge more gamers into trying game pass or buying in the PC store and if it works really well, we'll start seeing more publishers support the Xbox PC launcher natively.

@BaldB3lper78 Just to note (because I'm worried about the mention of overtime) all the user friendly stuff is coming to all windows devices eventually. You could wait and buy an older Z1E handheld once that happens. I'm just saying, please don't break your back over the device. I just wanted to make sure you know this won't be a unique device. This particular post is about a regular Xbox App update for insiders. Anyone can get it on any PC. But yeah, as long as that's clear, use your savings how you want.

@GeeEssEff Steam is not one of the currently available apps for testing, but you can see for yourself if you use Xbox game bar in compact mode. I have the update and it functions the same as the Xbox Game Bar quick list apps. Same for the games. They do need Steam launched in the and they'll do that first when you click on them. It's a little wonky. If you know you're using steam games a lot it'd probably be better to run steam in the background on startup.

They need to work on it for full release. But full release will also be the full screen Xbox mode that more drastically changes windows for gaming.

@GeeEssEff Outside of the Steam Deck I can't think of another that does in the PC space. Not disagreeing that it should be standard, but I usually don't see it advertised with these handhelds. At least for my legion go I remember it being like a "premium bonus" for the slightly more expensive one with more storage. Curious if someone can chime in about the OG Ally. Now it'd be really interested if they took a free case away.

I truly do love that Xbox is at a place where games like Keeper can be announced like less than 6 months before they release. That's great. No rush on getting titles out there, no unrealistic expectations, and heck no pressure to keep wasting resources to make games that aren't working out. Double Fine has made some of my favorite games. I'm glad to know they're cooking.

Also that subtitle pun is such a dad joke; if you were a gorilla I'd slap you 👀.

I'm not sure why people are still surprised by the price. Come on guys. I've literally seen all of you talk about how this is a PC OEM and not subsidized first party optimized hardware. It'll have the price of a gaming PC OEM + tarrifs making it more expensive (and potentially even more expensive in its final price). I can't say I care much personally because Microsoft has already stated that the software for the full screen Xbox mode, the best part about this device, is eventually coming to all windows devices and specifically gaming handhelds. This is a big Xbox PC OEM moment to serve as a showcase, but it's far from the last gaming PC OEM we'll see and regardless we know Microsoft is working to bring these windows gaming improvements to add devices. I'll happily download the update on my Lenovo Legion Go (which also heads up if you are interested in a PC handheld now due to the Xbox ROG Ally, the Z1E chip models are still holding up really well (in fact I think they're supposed to be more powerful than the Z2A), so you'll have a ton of options on sale or second hand.

@GeeEssEff The Steam Deck is also weaker and it's first party hardware (so no OS licensing fees). The cheapest base model of the Z1E handhelds are all more expensive than the most expensive Steam Deck model. Truly these are windows gaming PC OEMs and if you're not interested in that and just looking for a budget handheld other options (or sales) are better. The Z1E handhelds actually are probably a fantastic budget option right now. Still capable and they'll be getting the software features of this one eventually.

@KITG_Group_BrunoB Not canceled "shelved" which could mean anything. The actual story is just that they moved resources from the team to get the full screen Xbox mode up and ready. But anyway, the sentence was hypothetical. "An official first party handheld COULD be cheaper." It's current status doesn't really matter. I'm just saying a PC OEM isn't going to be as cheap as official console hardware.

@HonestHick Same (in terms of hopes & purchasing plans regardless)

@JaffeGaffe Well this is the 2nd Gen handheld. I'd recommend checking out all the ROG Ally Z1E deep dives to give a clearer idea. No handheld is a series X powerhouse and then Gen has seen a stable 60fps be more of a problem than it should be on even the highest end hardware 😒.

@Coletrain Fair enough. If Microsoft doesn't answer your greed soon, I guess you could always use Nvidia GFN streaming on the edge browser on the console (to access steam games).

@HonestHick I'd definitely prefer a new Xbox console from Xbox first to kick start next Gen in Fall 2026. And then they can announce OEM Xbox PCs in Spring & Summer 2027 with previews at CES. Not that I haven't seen the rumors, it's just what I far prefer. And what makes sense to me. Even Microsoft doesn't usually let OEMs kick off their big new wave of hardware first (like the Surface Pro led the copilot+ PCs). That also seems like a poor way to celebrate the 25th anniversary of the original Xbox console. Regardless I'd definitely be waiting for the Xbox Xbox be it in 2026 or 2027.

@Banjo- I mean it's easily believable. In fact I'd say it's incredibly predictable. You have to go out of your way to learn about, find, and purchase a third party controller. So they have an actual incentive to be good and appeal to gamers that look up a controller's build quality. Meanwhile the default options are the default options. They know gamers will use their controllers regardless of build quality. And it saves them money. So they're financially incentivized to offer lower quality products.

It's finally happening. Somebody pinch me. (and I don't even play sidescrollers or metrovanias like that; I'm excited purely through osmosis).

@Coletrain I mean you don't need to wait. You could set a PC build up connect to your TV, use just your controller and be "mostly" fine. If not there's stuff like playnite and Steam big picture mode. The Xbox Full screen experience is also supposed to be the solution to all our prayers. And it should hit broader general availability (not just on ROG Xbox Ally devices) sooner than the PC/console hybrid. Of course I say all of this not doing any of it myself. Like I said, I don't feel nearly settled enough to build a dedicated PC setup in the living room or for a desk.