Fragpiper

The problem isn't the hardware it's the platform now. There's literally nothing they're doing/saying that is making people say, "Gee, it seems like Xbox is going to have a renaissance and I think it'll be the best place to play games." On PC, GP is like just a supplemental service now to complement whatever your main library is where purchase things. And console-only gamers have less reasons to not get a Playstation with every passing announcement Xbox has. So the real issue is the ecosystem. For those who love cloud gaming it's a great platform, but native apps are still pretty rare. For instance, Apple lifted all the restrictions close to what, 18 months ago? And there's still no native iOS or AppleTV app. Just a small example but if you're going to tell me everything is an Xbox but I can't play on my "everything" it really doesn't matter.

After largely abandoning Xbox this generation the idea of being able to plays Game Pass and other storefronts on an officially supported windows device got me to preorder. I have hopes this means Steam purchases will continue to be supported in living rooms.

I've lost faith in Xbox's long-term viability. All 'purchases' are now on Playstation. My Xbox only gets used now where there's a GP game I want to play and I'll sub for a month.

I don't have as rosy an outlook as others. This seemingly talks about multiple chips so now it'll be a Steam situation where you'll have to worry about how your Xbox-branded product will play a certain game? Look at how just supporting X and S caused "issues." Even the ROG Xbox Ally has two different models that are seemingly quite far apart spec wise. It'll just get more and more confusing. But I'll reserve final judgement until the next console is officially released but they seem to be moving in a direction that I have less interest in following them in.

@CaptainCluck the people that buy their phones knowing what ecosystem they have and perhaps even do it on purpose to feel secure in said ecosystem have the freedom to choose different phones. This quite honestly can increase monopolistic power as people have less reasons to use other phone companies.

I genuinely have trouble understanding why a company has to allow other stores on their platform. They put the R&D and infrastructure to maintain. If Apple doesn’t get revenue from the App Store they’ll have to find other revenue sources - perhaps even charging developer fees that would hurt smaller devs.

@Banjo- I guess if enjoying Sony’s first party games makes me a fan, then yes? But I’ve been with Xbox for years and as a casual player, pretty proud of my 70k gamerscore.

As a point of fact - PS Plus or whatever they call it does have first party games, though just not day one.

I think what you listed is true… but it’s becoming more of a specific case. I still maintain that PS is a better suggestion in general to most people. At the end of the day you're still getting more game options on PS.

Hm... Yes? But after switching to maining a PS5 Pro I very much feel that Sony is far and away the better option for most people. With the continued march towards releasing everything on PlayStation anyway, it's hard to justify telling someone to go out and spend money on the Xbox ecosystem.

All dozens of them

No. With “everything” coming to PlayStation the value just isn’t there anymore. In the event of an exclusive I can get a month of GP and play in the cloud.

But I believe Microsoft is 100% ok with this line of thinking and how I really see them killing home consoles in the long run

But wait don’t you worry. GP prices will increase in short order too

I don’t have the rosy outlook a lot of these comments seem to have. It shows Microsoft that they can continue to make money and dominate in gaming without a console. GP growth was for PC and they highlighted cloud gaming hours. They most definitely see a future without their own console. I don’t mind. I’m excited for cloud gaming to take over, but this isn’t a second coming of Xbox as a console. It still is lagging Xbox One (ouch) and they haven’t turned around the decline in consoles. Sure it may have not been as bad as last year but it still continued to decline.

And for the rest of this generation Sony will be the best place to play console games on the Pro.

It’s good news for Microsoft and shareholders but not for Xbox console fans.

Perhaps I’m in the minority but I find the idea of the WiFi controller really intriguing. I would LOVE to pivot to cloud gaming in the future and not need a console. In fact I plan on getting PS6 and no Xbox. However - if Microsoft ever has an exclusive I want to play it’s literally no big deal to just buy a controller and play it wherever I want from the cloud.

I think the point is that the cloud needs consoles to stream games and the idea of owning a console will eventually be a novelty. They’re not getting out of the console business… but they will eventually be getting out of the home console business.

They see streaming Game Pass as the lowest barrier of entry. If people still want to buy games and a console that plays them they’ll be options for that too ala Sony or PC

I’ll for sure give it a try on Game Pass. But I don’t know about “hype.” I think the game just had excellent marketers and it’s hard to turn around in the gaming world without seeing some vlog or sponsored content about this.

Honestly Microsoft could take some notes on how to market games.

My faith in Xbox has diminished and I only use it for GP now; Sony gets my purchases. That being said, I'm very fascinated to see where Team Green is going though.

@Kilamanjaro it’s possible. But I tend to think Microsoft takes this much more seriously than Google did. (Pretty much anyone takes anything more seriously than Google. RIP like every Google project ever). Microsoft also has a better grasp of the hurdles - it has taken the time to build out Game Pass to change the consumer perception of what a subscription means in gaming. And not just replace a console with the cloud. The younger generation is going to cringe at the thought of spending $70+ a game when then can just sub and play a whole bunch of games. To say nothing of the idea of spending the money on a console initially. I don’t think Microsoft believes cloud gaming with usurp the PC gamers, but it’s a viable alternative for console gamers.

@Millionski Yes. Plus when they don't need to target a living room box in price and form factor it'll allow them to iterate quicker and have more powerful options.

And if Playstation cloud gaming ever takes off, Microsoft still wins because it uses their Azure infrastructure. They've essentially won in this sector before it's even really began.

@Markatron84 You have to wonder if this strategy will open up the possibility of other acquisitions with courts seeing how they're bring games to more platforms and actually reducing exclusivity.

Within the decade if GamePass cloud streaming grows more accessible, they win 'the console war.' Old guard gamers may be upset by not having a console, but it's just like video streaming. 4K quality is demonstrably better from a 4K Blu-ray on a disc player, but as a society we've really said that streaming is 'good enough' quality. Same will happen with gaming.

No upfront hardware cost besides a wifi connected controller and an entire catalog of games with all your saves will win everyday. PC gamers will always exist to have the cutting edge tech. But for the rest of us and especially the younger generation, being able to stream will be a game changer.

Plus Microsoft doesn't care if you stream on Playstation or Xbox because Playstation uses their Azure infrastructure anyway.

Castlevania Lords of Shadow 3!!!

I've grown to be OK with all this. Microsoft has made it clear they care about selling games and don't care what platform you buy them on. Yeah it sucks for those who really enjoy the Xbox console, but in the long run will allow gamers to play more games without needing as much hardware. Plus Game Pass will continue to mature and provide a genuinely console-less proposition for people.

But that being said, they'll still need the cloud infrastructure to support GP so they're incentivized to put R&D into continued console development for the near future because they need that hardware to run GP servers too. In the longer term they could easily drop the living room form factor/cost point and be able to provide better hardware on the cloud than consoles could provide (at the expected price point). Very much like NVIDIA.

I think they have a game, set, match thing going on. They've already won from their perspective and the rest of us are just really realizing what game they were even playing in the first place.

I really think the story should be "Microsoft" not "Xbox." Xbox is legacy at this point. Microsoft is enjoying good games and publishing them on everything. Gamers win when we have good games!

But Xbox... I don't know how anyone thinks Xbox as a console brand had a good year. Microsoft went out of there way this year to announce that you don't actually need an Xbox console because "everything is an Xbox" which we're seeing now even includes PlayStation.

I think diehard console Xbox fans had the worst year in the franchise's history.

@Casco Are we the same person? I could have written that exact post lol

It's so cringey to see embedded posts from the X wannabe. Ruins the entire article.

@Fishticon oof that truth bomb though. Yeah especially now they play best on PS5 Pro so you’re actually beta testing the inferior product

@Fiendish-Beaver Yeah - I moved over to PS5 Pro for purchases of games. Ironic though that Xbox games will play best on PS5 Pro until Microsoft releases something new.

It’s not necessary but I would love the option of getting to decide for myself if I want to spend more for a higher resolution/frame rate option the same way PC gamers can decide if they want to spend more for a better GPU.

Last month I started buying my games on PlayStation instead of Xbox. I hope GamePass succeeds and finds it way to PlayStation, but I just don’t have faith in Xbox-as-a-console any longer. I think it’s obvious Microsoft sees the PC market as their bread and butter and I have faith that Sony still has all the incentive to remain a hardware company

@GeorgeKal you really truly think they spent that to somehow catchup with Sony? Naw bruh, they bought that to sell software. On every single piece of hardware they can get it on.

@GeorgeKal mmm ok. You keep telling yourself that shareholders are chill with them leaving millions in sales on the table just to say they have exclusives that by all numbers are not driving console sales. The only exclusive Xbox will end up with is GamePass.

@GeorgeKal says who? Clearly they considered 6 and then pivoted. This move to multiplatform has been planned for a long time.

Gears 6 would have appealed to players familiar with the series. This is a fresh story. Perfect for attracting new players. Maybe 60 million of them with PlayStations…

Of course they are. They either sell games or they sell the companies. If people still don’t believe that they care more about selling games (or subs) rather than consoles they simply just aren’t paying attention.

This article won’t age well. Microsoft didn’t buy Activision to sell consoles - they bought it to sell content. If Microsoft could get Game Pass on PS5 they’d do it tomorrow.

@IOI what?

In US:
Disc-free 1TB $450
Disc 1TB $500
Disc 2TB $600

@dskatter “people like having the disc drive option.” I’m digital only and totally appreciate that both Xbox and Sony give people options. Let’s me save money by not needing to pay for hardware I’ll never use and let people like you choose an option that fits your lifestyle.

I feel they dropped the ball on these. There’s nothing to get existing customers excited about. Like or dislike the PS5 pro at least people are talking about it. This is so lackluster they could have at least slightly tweaked the physical design ala PS5 Slim revisions.

I’d also imagine UE5 will make it easier to port to PlayStation.

@GamingFan4Lyf pretty sure most any Kohls has game wear

@__jamiie it offer gamers a choice to game at higher fidelity at higher frame rates over base or at least offer more options. It’s a very simple proposition.

But equally obvious to me is no answer will appease as you as you clearly know better about what other people should care about and spend their money on.

@__jamiie "Stand up for Sony's shilling." Lol ok buddy. Perhaps I'm standing up for choice and an expanded market offering. If people don't want the Pro they just get the regular. There's literally no one putting a gun to your head making you get it. Gaming is a luxury not an entitlement. If you think there's another option that is a better fit for you have at it. I'm happy that there are options that you can pick from. If you think Sony is milking customers, the great news is you don't have to give your money to Sony.

Let's not berate and disparage people who see value and purpose in the offering from Sony. More options are better for everyone.

@__jamiie shrug I mean that same argument could be made to PC gamers for upgrading their GPU because they want a game to run at 60fps in higher quality. Sure they could be happy turning down the settings or just playing 30fps but no one gets angry if a PC gamer goes out to buy a new graphics card. I don't understand why this is so personal to so many. If you don't want it, don't buy it. If you do - great! I'm happy that the market can support multiple tiers and options for gamers.

This is a silly take. If I as a customer see value in getting higher graphical fidelity at 60fps and have the discretionary income to make the purchase, I would like the option of getting to purchase it the same PC gamers have the option of springing for better graphic cards.

This article feels like a salty fanboy trying to convince themselves that it's better to have a less powerful piece of kit now.

There are now dozens of them!!!

This made me feel better about my PS5 Pro Preorder.

@JoyfulFire I don't disagree but I also don't know where this "ecosystem" is. Is there something actually more than Xbox and PCs? Will they bring it to Nintendo? Will Apple get native streaming apps? Where can I actually play 'where I want' as Spencer is frequently heard saying? I feel like that's been a pretty stagnant front for Microsoft. I'm afraid that PC is really all they will really put their efforts towards.

I would imagine if the Xbox figures were severely underestimated Microsoft would make a statement if not to give the real number, but to say “it’s higher than this.” This makes me inclined to believe it’s roughly around this 28M mark

I don’t like it, but I get this model of adding premium additions to GP games for DLC. It was successful clearly if they’re doing it again with Indy. But I can’t help but be peeved. It’s like Netflix letting you watch the first season of a show but forcing you to buy the rest that is locked into their platform. It’s starting to diminish the value and - key to me - ease of GP to me. I’m at the age (and income) in life that I value service and would just rather have a more expensive truly all-in-one service than nickel and diming add-ons.

In fact, I would genuinely rather pay more for like a Game Pass Ultimate Premium sub and not need to worry about purchases.

@dskatter articles exist ad nauseam on the topic. I would venture it’s relativity late into the next gen development cycle to pull out now. But who knows. Xbox has made me leery enough that for the first time since the PS3 I’m hesitant to actually buy a multiplat on Xbox. If you read between the lines for the last 18mo it seems to be all about the platform instead of the box itself. This is one of the only comments I recall Phil making explicitly about new hardware.

https://www.gamesradar.com/phil-spencer-shuts-down-multiplatform-rumors-says-next-gen-xbox-console-will-respect-the-investments-that-people-have-made-in-the-platform/