Play Anywhere is indeed the main reason I buy on xbox, and am a lot more likely to buy on xbox if the game has that label. I have been purging my Steam Wishlisth of any game that is play anywhere on xbox and ignoring them even if I see a good sale.
If we ever get full confirmation that the introduction of the Helix will mean ALL xbox games will work on PC (even if a limited form of PC) I might stop buying games on Steam entirely (unless the game is not on Xbox at all).
Would love to see it, not least it might make Sony kow-tow, but I think it's unlikely. If PS5 is 15% physical what is Xbox? 5% - 10% max
Sony manipulated those numbers. They were based off total sales, including sales for trophy farming indie games that costs a few dollars and are only digital. Leaks have revealed that their own first party games tend to sell anywhere from 50% to 75% in physical form.
Xbox can have its cake and eat it to just by offering an attachment drive that can be sold separately without disrupting core SKU manufacturing, and having disks on shelves alone can bring visibility especially if Sony entirely vanishes from store shelves and it's just Nintendo and Xbox out there. Even if the base still mostly buys digital, that's free advertisement right there and a huge amount of karma gain.
One thing we can tell for sure is that Asha pays A LOT of attention to social media. She is certainly VERY aware of the mess Sony triggered and will likely capitalize.
But if she is to be strategic about it, she will keep quite long enough for Sony not to be able to walk this back. If she stays silent and lets Sony reveal a diskless PS6, she can then reveal Helix with a cd drive or optional attachment alongside a promisse to continue supporting physical disks for as long as players buy them.
I honestly can see why Asha, at least for the next few years (2-5) is likely to only want to greenlit proven IP. Xbox is shifting due to too much experimentation and too many gambles failing. At this point, the goal is going to be IPs that bring consumer attention to the platform.
Just llike PlayStation has avoided experimentation and overly focused on their biggest IP (Horizon, Spider-Man, Ghost of, God of War) and Nintendo does not even need to try (Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Xenoblade), Xbox is at a position where they need to focus on the IP that are big and can create a strong platform identity.
New experimental IPs are not likely to fly, and IPs that have not proven themselves in since GenZ was born like Perfect Dark are also not likely to be greenlit either. At least not for their internal studios. Maybe outsourced with fixed budgets but they wont dedicate their staffs time to them.
So, expect a lot of "identity" or "core" IP if you want to be the focus for the next 5 years:
Forza, Fable, Halo, Gears, Elder Scrolls, Fallout, Doom, Minecraft, Diablo, Warcraft, Call of Duty, Quake (I admit I only add this one because Asha mentioned it but it puzzles me) and so on.
I would had loved to see a Perfect Dark by id Software, but not only is the IP practically a brand new thing for GenZ, but its recent failure is way too recent on way too many people's mind to be brought up again so soon.
That said... I do wonder what they expect id Software to do. I highly doubt they will hand off Doom to anyone else, and the studio sounds to have been shrunk too much to effectively develop a Quake game from the ground up. Only thing I can see them realistically make in their current state is an iterational Doom sequel with minimal new tech/innovation.
I did not know about this game until this week. The trailer makes it look like a blend of Legacy of Kain and Witcher... of course: I need this in my library now!
Sounds like someone told Todd that he cant keep monopolizing these IPs until he has time to work on them. About time! He cant spearhead every single IP!
As for Avowed, I am disapointed but like hearing that they seem to be allowed to dedicate a small team to keep it in low-budget development. Personally, I think limited resources can result in better final products than being given a blank check. Get too high of a budget and you might keep feature creeping. Give somone hard and harsh limits, and they get creative fast.
Hell, Fallout New Vegas was such a constrained project and look how amazing it ended up being!
@themightyant Maybe I don't agree with every point but yea basically that.
The PlayStation ports were just a way to squeeze more money out of some titles in hopes to keep financing doomed studios. Those 5 studios (Arkane seems to be in the list) delivered next to nothing for MS for too many years. At least Obsidian kept delivering game after game, even if only Grounded was a hit. It still meant that one title made the whole studio profitable, and rather early on.
yeah but that amounts to the same thing. The game pass model subsidising those studios didn't work. It absolutely COULD work, but the games would have to be GOTY contenders
But it DID work. If it had not, Asha would had not blinked at eye at killing it, Xbox would had been running at a loss instead of the 3% margins it had. The fact that 5 studios were running for nearly 8 years draining high triple A development budgets and not bringing any revenue [even when the few that managed to ship did so] is indeed testament that it worked.
No system, regardless how efficient, can ever subsidize that amount of spending forever. Phil's only chance would had been for at least half of those projects to break even once they launched and they didnt even do that.
I think a lot of people are taking this to mean something that was not stated. When Asha wants to reach 1 billion daily users, she is talking of all current and future xbox segments.
This means mobile games (king), pc games, xbox console games (regardless of who publishes them, it's about them buying/renting/whatever from Xbox's store) TV Shows (like fallout) and movies (again, selling them and having you watch them on an Xbox client).
Asha also has a background on Meta/Facebook, FB has over 5 billion daily users. I would not be shocked if Asha attempts to expand Xbox live beyond gaming and into a social media platform of its own.
It also should say a lot that she wants King and Mojang will report directly to her and called Candy Crush and Minecraft platforms in and onto themselves.
@Coletrain If it was NOT working, the studios that got divested from would had been shut down 4 years ago. They were producing nothing for too long. GP literally financed those titles. It was working, it was those studios that were just eating all the allowance by not just taking too long to deliver anything but also having their end products not be market-viable (at least not considering the resources tossed at them.)
@FatGuyInLilCoat Just a note: Xbox One users can find plenty of value on all GP tiers. There is a large catalog of XBox one games there to play natively, and they also get access to XSX games via streaming from the comfort of a console's ergonomic (TV/Couch/Controller).
@themightyant I think it would "survive", but it would become a shadow of itself if it loses the revenue stream to justify securing third party deals. At minimal scale, GP would be forced to only add a few small indies and exclusively rely on first party offerings to re-grow.
... but I'm thinking along the lines of if they had to take new CODs away...
Wanted to touch on this bit: the problem with CoD is that it was a massive acquisition. It's a game they expected to make GP grow. Problem with that plan was that anyone buying CoD was already certainly subscribed to either GP Core or GPU to even be able to play online (unless it was a rare "just want the campaign" CoD player).
The point with all this is that as soon as CoD got added to GPU, at most, it got some GPExtra and GPCore members upgrade to GPU for minimal boost in revenue. They got a few new users to hop into GP on PC for the first time but that likely did not justify the losses in sales from the previous status quo.
Point being, it's not the same to add a brand-new game to a service as part of its value as it is to eliminate an existing revenue line to justify that service's value UNLESS you can make that result in giantic service growth, something that was virtually impossible to happen.
THAT, is, IMO, why CoD addition to GP did not really math-out. It's not an issue with any other new titles being added to the service. It IS an issue for something that people have requested for a long time though: Adding WoW subscription as a GP perk. That wont ever work out.
@Coletrain I can see them feeling making GP any cheaper is not going to work financially for them, even if the player sticks for a full year. But that's where they could had use the lock-in as a means to mitigate the price hike.
In fact, I would dare say that Asha perhaps should had considered offering a 240 yearly sub as an alternative to removing CoD and lowering the per-month price.
.. and all the other pseudo maths. This isn't how subscriptions work,
Agree with all of this.
It's pretty disastrous. Services like this ONLY work at scale.
Dont entirely agree with this though. Yes, most services like Netflix indeed ONLY work at scale, but GP is different. Netflix only sells their subscription. If they spend 100 million on a show, they expect enough subscribers to cover the cost as that's the only way to justify it. Xbox sells their game in addition to adding them to the service. So they are not as reliant on scale as others.
It still is a failure to have messed up the growth but not because it becomes unsustainable. Instead it's because that growth is a backbone to the core of Xbox. GP subs dont just increase the bottom line, they also lock in players into the ecosystem (be it Xbox consoles or Xbox app on PC) and from there those users are more likely to buy third party products.
So yes, devastating to their strategy but it's not as critical for it to work at massive scale as it is for the likes of Disney+ and Netfllix.
Also these stats kind of show otherwise, people are dropping!
If you read the article, it also states the trend changed with the recent price reductions. People dropping is not a trend, people dropping due to the price hike just caused a devastating blow to their progress.
I don't subscribe to GP myself (well, I do have the essential tier for online multiplayer that I only use in FFXIV). I want a game, I tend to buy it. I used to be subscribed when the cost were low enough that it did not bother me "wasting" most months of the year.
IMO, Premium is the best value subscription. Especially for a new customer that instantly gets access to a gigantic back catalog. I just wish they were more predictable. I think EAPlay puts all their games exactly 12 months after launch. GP Premium is "sometime within 12 months". Even if sometimes that is better, I would prefer predictability.
As for tiers, controversial take: GPU price hike was itself not the problem, but it was very poorly thought out. The hike was aimed at the group of people that only subscribe for one or two months to play a big new title and then drop out. The smart solution would had been for GPU to go to 30 BUT offer a year option where the player commits to the 12 months for a decent discount that net no hike from the old model (20 a month).
For me, 20 is still to high to subscribe and forget, but I'm sure they would had faced fewer unsubscribers and continued growth. As it stands, they set themselves back several years on their growth goals.
I ended up preordering it and cant wait to get off work tomorrow. Hopefully its fully installed by the time I get home.
The reviews changed nothing since I was already all in, plus I got it on xbox that has about as good a return policy as Steam so had I been desatisfied within an hour I could get my money back. I don't expect to, though.
I played this game twice. 100% everything and got all Single Player achievements on Xbox and am only missing 2 sp Trophies on PS4. Are this game's online servers even on anymore? I sometimes feel tempted to revisit it and finallly get those too even if it's a grind because I just like the game that much.
I really hope they take this further and do AC3 next, because modern tech migh allow them to finally make the battle segments a lot more fun by actually having hundreads of NPCs battling on screen.
@TDHorizon I can partially understand the desire for unique landmark/loot reward, but all I care is for the activity itself. Be it figuing out how to reach a hard to grab collectible, complete some puzzle or complete a fight. For me, the reward is the content itself.
Executing and clearing those objectives, for me, is just fun on and of itself enough to justify them being there.
@themightyant I work in a HUGE shop. I know sometimes/often the layers are necessary. No one can effectively micro-manage 100 creative professionals effectively by themselves, management trees are needed to be more effective.
Of course the 14 layers was not universal. I am nearly certain it was primarily/deeper in ABK and Bethesda, that were brought in yet had minimal structural adjustments.
I'm still certain a lot of those layers were unecesary redundancies. And as much as I will go to the grave defending Phil (Xbox would no longer even exist without his contributions) I also think he hated doing many management things and just created additional layers to avoid doing so and "give studios creative freedom".
@Banjo- I'm not going to say I like it. Honestly I don't, she could handle things a lot more tactfully and still get similar results, she is going to get a bad rap soon and people will likely end up seeing her as a grim ripper.
I also know people that work inside Xbox Games Studios (I wont elaborate), and they in turn know people and have family. I am not happy one bit about any of this.
I do know for sure this could have been way way worse than its being. It sucks, big time, but it could had been so much worse and am sure many were preparing for that even worse case scenario.
@themightyant 5% of the gross revenue is not cheap for a publisher that is struggling to reach at least a 15% profit margin and already has internal engines (they are not saving on developing one).
@themightyant I think part of what got us here is that Phil bought these studios, integrated them into Microsoft Proper, but let them behave as independent subsidiaries (why they likely ended with 14 layers of management).
Only that an independent subsidiary usually needs to be a lot more careful about their own finances, Xbox just let them forget about the money and let them do whatever they wanted passing the bill up to MS when GP revenue would not cover it.
As for Halo, I have serious doubt Halo "6" development has even started in ernest, but that's just me being an extreme cynic and finding recently that State of Decay 3 didn't really start development until 2025 despite its 2020 reveal.
Edit: and yes, we been clearly told that anything that was the plan before is no longer the plan.
@Markatron84 Mostly said that becaus the rumors had been going on for a LONG time (supposedly the canned Battle Royale mode for Infinity was going to be done in Unreal and there were even rumors of a full Unreal transition for Infinite post launch).
But I'll stand corrected that it was an official statement and no longer just a rummor.
@Banjo- Agree. Still it IS annoying that it sounds they were just fired without being given a "do you want to relocate under the IW8 team?" even if that came with physical relocation requirements.
(again, this is only if it is indeed the reason, but I cant see any other reason to kill idTech than to reduce redundancy)
Anyone with long term memory that can remember my posting knows I have not been a fan of Asha from the get go and I have been very critical of many of her calls so far.
I know you are not specifically talking about me, but you might be including me under the umbrella. What I am doing is literally thinking for myself and trying to actually resolve what logic Asha is using.
I also stated this in Push Square: if I am right I still feel these coders should had been given a chance to move to the IW8 development team instead of just being fired. Depreciating the engine and removing redundancies is one thing, getting rid of solid talent that can help a potential "Xbox Engine" is something I still find like a cruel waste.
@themightyant That's what I am expecting, for the unreal plans to change again. Unreal is not a cheap engine and really can eat on revenues of larger titles. It can be cheap/free for indies but AAA titles likely pay huge slices of their revenue to Unreal for the convenience of using their pre-packaged product.
@Fiendish-Beaver If I understand the bits we are putting together from multiple articles, these are not "only coders", but specifically idTech coders, not game logic coders.
There might be some there, as well as others (it was not JUST coders) but it does really sound as the bulk was the team in charge of maintaining and developing the idTech engine.
There are certainly still coders that focus on content and mission scripting still there, and idTech sharing a root with IW8 might minimize any training overheads relative to a brand new engine.
Everyone: Do keep in mind that my talks about IW8 taking over at Xbox is just a theory based on a likely cold corporate view of reducing redundancies AND licensing fees of third party engines.
@xboxjapanfan If my theory is correct, expect a very similar news from Halo studios soon. Although I think their engine team might had already been disolved under Phil.
@Banjo- @Markatron84 That's port was done by a separate studio (think outsourced) and so was the talks and rumors about halo using Unreal in the future.
I think since Asha's appointment they are looking to reduce costs and that likely includes minimizing unecesary license overheads of Unreal Engine. Hell I would not be shocked if whatever next entry is done for Gears (be it Gear's 6 or Emergence Day 2 or whatever) is mandated to be done using IW8.
I think Asha is a lot more financially driven than previous management and is unlikely to be swayed by "but this engine is key to the feel of the game", especially if they are forced to pay a third party for it's use.
Plus: Unreal has been getting worse over time and the promises of UE5 at the start of the generation have not really materialized. The only benefit for UE was that it was easier to hire talent for, especially given some annoying hiring policies enforced by upper management at MS on how long they can maintain a contract for. That forced them to lose contractors that spent months training on inshouse tools, and Phil likely hoped switching to Unreal would remove the training barrier.
Asha has so far managed to get some more breathing room from upper MS management so long she does what she been tasked, so maybe she can change that policy if only within Xbox.
Not justifying this, this stucks and that cant be ignored.
I do think I see whats going on here, though. Push Square noted most of the members let go here were coders likely maintaining idTech. After all it's aquisitions, Xbox has at least 3 engines that are being used exactly for the same goal: FPS (Slipspace Engine for Halo, idTech for Doom/Wolfenstein, IW8 for Call of Duty).
Add to that the fact that IW8 was an evolution of idTech 3.
It sort of makes sense that they might opt to cut on that department and mandate that future entries of halo, id and machine games all start using the same engines Call of Duty uses.
@Banjo- Even if they didnt perform as expected, they were still games published by Xbox and added to the GP library under the whole promisse of first party games going there. It might not be a great consumer pitch if they end up getting removed.
It was previous management, but are cuphead and Ori games still there despite Xbox letting those studios self publish their games on other platforms?
@Banjo- It's hard to tell. MS might be willing to just release the publishing deals but a reason many publishing deals expire is they tend to have clauses that rights revert to the IP owner should publication go idle for a specific amount of time. In the day of physical media (books, movie, games) that was way more likely.
In the digital era, its virtually impossible for a publishing contract to expire unless there is a hard date because the media is almost always being actively published digitally. A hard date might be there, we likely wont ever really know since those contracts are always kept secret.
@Banjo- I'm not sure if they own the games, but even if they did, most those games publishing rihghts are already locked with Xbox Game Publishing and that publishing contract likely does not have an expiration date. Does not mean they wont let them find a new publisher to release the game in some new platform if they want, but at the end of the day the publishing rights can be more important than game ownership itself.
Like, Obsidian and Outer Worlds. Even with Xbox owning the IP and game, they cant really do anything with Outer Worlds 1 because the publishing rights for that one belong to Private Division (Take Two).
@GoldenPants There is likely some hooks. Like: you get the IP but we get first dibs on publishing anything you make for the next X years, also dibs for GamePass inclusion.
Outside that, MS either gets money (for the studios they sold) or get to write off the cost of the studos for the ones they divested from.
@Rangers420 I appreciate the graphics but I love their games for the gameplay. I never understood the people that just cant accept not every game style is for them. Ubisoft "formula" games are my favorite style of game and they make them better than anyone else IMO.
And say what anyone whants: the whole industry is just copying the formula left and right because it's good! Anyone that insists Sony's Spider-Man, Horizon Zero Dawn, Ghost of Tsushima and all these modern open world are not just Ubisoft Formula games under a different publishing banner are just in denial.
I know these comparisons get lots of attention but, outside of making the owners of higher end hardware feel better about their investment, I don't understand the point.
All versions really seem to look and play great. Yes there are differences but someone that owns a Series S is likely already used to the quality that comes with the hardware they play on.
There are very few games where the lower end hardware really results in a horrible experience, and those end up being the only cases I find these useful. Having one done for nearly every major game, makes it that more harder to highlight those cases.
Anyways rant aside, really looking forward to playing this! I ended up preordering and I don't work Friday so going to dive in as soon as I get home Thursday!
So far this is the best bit of news from all of these. Instead of risking being axed by some corporation, all these studios seem to be given a chance at carving their own future and succeeding or failing on their own terms.
I for one really hope Compulsion Games specifically takes advantage of existing IPs they still own and don't jump into a brand new project. They have tons of assets they can create sequels with, allowing for lower budget production and quicker turnaround should they manage themselves wisely. If they follow that path, they dont need millions of sales to justify the games budgets, and slowly get themselves afloat.
I really really want a sequel to South of Midnight, I don't care for any gameplay flaws. They can polish that and give us more of that gorgeous world.
Ninja Theory seems to have learned that lesson with the new Hellblade game. It's turnaround is so quick they likely are doing a lot of asset reuse, while also addressing some of the biggest consumer concerns and making a more action focused game in that same setting.
I also hope Xbox keeps friendly relationship and offers them Game Pass deals that help them fund their cycles.
General reply to many comments: the reason we seem to get these games (Fallout/ElderScrolls/Starfield) so far in between eachother is that with the exception of New Vegas, Todd seems to insist being the one leading the core development of every new entry in these games. No Todd, no new Fallout, Elder Scroll or Starfield.
Elder Scrolls 6 was not being worked on in parallel with Starfield. It was just teased but actual production didn't start until Starfield launch.
That's something Asha should definitively force a change on. Like, literally the only one of these entries that was not touched by Todd is the most beloved Fallout entry to date. And most of these games are also good not because the core game was good, but because the DLC make them what they became. DLC AND community mods.
Todd is a talented developer, but he is a single man and cant keep holding the flow so much. He needs to either be more high level supervisor or at least accept other teams working on some of their IPs while he focuses on his primary project.
@PartyMarty It's still bad, at most those studios are likely 400 or 500 (and the 500 is me stretching it) so thats still a lot of job losses.
I only want to be pragmatic, not to cover the sky with my hand. This whole thing sucks, as much as its important to recognize this is far from the worst case scenario.
IF these cuts are indeed primarily to management positions [the ones responsible to keep projects in track and obviously didn't] and not the actual workforce... it still sucks because its still people losing their jobs on a terrible economy, but it's more bearable than the end coders/artists/designers/etc being the ones that get cut off.
@Fiendish-Beaver "Some of the games or studios could well have been under consideration for cancellation or closure"
Thing is: it likely was considered but they also considered options. In fact, it seemed they went out of their way to make cancelations and shutdowns the absolute last alternative.
Some other publishers never consider such options and just shut things down entirely. The news is bad, and that should not be ignored, but the fact that its being handled this way in an industry that trends towards just shutting studios down and tossing IPs into a vault should also be aknowledged.
Am I the only one that was expecting Xbox to shut down these studios AND fire 5,000 people? I partially dont think I am since PushSquare is trying to push that its actually 4,800 firings.
They are adding up today's 1,600 with the total 3,200 number as if they are two separate waves despite Asha clearly saying the other 1,600 jobs will be eliminated through the fiscal year (for the 3,200 total).
At this point it would be stupid for Xbox not to offer a disk drive, even is as an attachment. PlayStation literally tossed the ball at xbox's feet and they have a chance to score big by offering it at least as an option.
Ninja Theory - 120 employees (as of 2020)
Compulsion Games - 80 (as of 2021)
Double Fine - 105 (as of 2025)
Undead Labs - 60 (as of 2018)
Some of these are very old numbers and likely a bit lower than they are today but doubt any are smaller. Still also doubt any are double their last reported size. Even with a generous 10% staff boost, we would only be looking at roughly 400 jobs out of that 3200 not being firings or retirements. That still likely means 2800 people no longer have a job, and we have no way to know of those how many might be retirements.
At the end, this news is bad, but this is not the news PlayStation was likely hoping to take the heat away from their physical games heat.
Timelines. Those studios were bought when xbox was starting to expand, running on a much more limited budget and trying to prove itself to upper management with GamePass. They did not have the exec favor at that point to get a green light on acquiring anything larger than these studios.
Comments 4,223
Re: 30 Games Have Just Been Added To Xbox Play Anywhere
Play Anywhere is indeed the main reason I buy on xbox, and am a lot more likely to buy on xbox if the game has that label. I have been purging my Steam Wishlisth of any game that is play anywhere on xbox and ignoring them even if I see a good sale.
If we ever get full confirmation that the introduction of the Helix will mean ALL xbox games will work on PC (even if a limited form of PC) I might stop buying games on Steam entirely (unless the game is not on Xbox at all).
Re: Video Game Retailer Urges Xbox To 'Stand Behind Consumer Choice' By Supporting Physical
@themightyant
Sony manipulated those numbers. They were based off total sales, including sales for trophy farming indie games that costs a few dollars and are only digital. Leaks have revealed that their own first party games tend to sell anywhere from 50% to 75% in physical form.
Xbox can have its cake and eat it to just by offering an attachment drive that can be sold separately without disrupting core SKU manufacturing, and having disks on shelves alone can bring visibility especially if Sony entirely vanishes from store shelves and it's just Nintendo and Xbox out there. Even if the base still mostly buys digital, that's free advertisement right there and a huge amount of karma gain.
Re: Video Game Retailer Urges Xbox To 'Stand Behind Consumer Choice' By Supporting Physical
One thing we can tell for sure is that Asha pays A LOT of attention to social media. She is certainly VERY aware of the mess Sony triggered and will likely capitalize.
But if she is to be strategic about it, she will keep quite long enough for Sony not to be able to walk this back. If she stays silent and lets Sony reveal a diskless PS6, she can then reveal Helix with a cd drive or optional attachment alongside a promisse to continue supporting physical disks for as long as players buy them.
Re: Report: id Software Pitched New Perfect Dark Before Xbox Layoffs
(Sorry for the wall of text)
I am going to be as objective as I can:
I honestly can see why Asha, at least for the next few years (2-5) is likely to only want to greenlit proven IP. Xbox is shifting due to too much experimentation and too many gambles failing. At this point, the goal is going to be IPs that bring consumer attention to the platform.
Just llike PlayStation has avoided experimentation and overly focused on their biggest IP (Horizon, Spider-Man, Ghost of, God of War) and Nintendo does not even need to try (Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Xenoblade), Xbox is at a position where they need to focus on the IP that are big and can create a strong platform identity.
New experimental IPs are not likely to fly, and IPs that have not proven themselves in since GenZ was born like Perfect Dark are also not likely to be greenlit either. At least not for their internal studios. Maybe outsourced with fixed budgets but they wont dedicate their staffs time to them.
So, expect a lot of "identity" or "core" IP if you want to be the focus for the next 5 years:
Forza, Fable, Halo, Gears, Elder Scrolls, Fallout, Doom, Minecraft, Diablo, Warcraft, Call of Duty, Quake (I admit I only add this one because Asha mentioned it but it puzzles me) and so on.
I would had loved to see a Perfect Dark by id Software, but not only is the IP practically a brand new thing for GenZ, but its recent failure is way too recent on way too many people's mind to be brought up again so soon.
That said... I do wonder what they expect id Software to do. I highly doubt they will hand off Doom to anyone else, and the studio sounds to have been shrunk too much to effectively develop a Quake game from the ground up. Only thing I can see them realistically make in their current state is an iterational Doom sequel with minimal new tech/innovation.
Re: Roundup: Here's What The Previews Are Saying About The Blood Of Dawnwalker
I did not know about this game until this week. The trailer makes it look like a blend of Legacy of Kain and Witcher... of course: I need this in my library now!
Re: Report: Xbox Cancels Avowed 2 And Puts Obsidian To Work On New Fallout Game
Sounds like someone told Todd that he cant keep monopolizing these IPs until he has time to work on them. About time! He cant spearhead every single IP!
As for Avowed, I am disapointed but like hearing that they seem to be allowed to dedicate a small team to keep it in low-budget development. Personally, I think limited resources can result in better final products than being given a blank check. Get too high of a budget and you might keep feature creeping. Give somone hard and harsh limits, and they get creative fast.
Hell, Fallout New Vegas was such a constrained project and look how amazing it ended up being!
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@themightyant Maybe I don't agree with every point but yea basically that.
The PlayStation ports were just a way to squeeze more money out of some titles in hopes to keep financing doomed studios. Those 5 studios (Arkane seems to be in the list) delivered next to nothing for MS for too many years. At least Obsidian kept delivering game after game, even if only Grounded was a hit. It still meant that one title made the whole studio profitable, and rather early on.
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@GlasgowGuy That would at minimum be 10 times as bad as the mess PlayStation got themselves into with their whole "no disks" anouncement.
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@Coletrain
But it DID work. If it had not, Asha would had not blinked at eye at killing it, Xbox would had been running at a loss instead of the 3% margins it had. The fact that 5 studios were running for nearly 8 years draining high triple A development budgets and not bringing any revenue [even when the few that managed to ship did so] is indeed testament that it worked.
No system, regardless how efficient, can ever subsidize that amount of spending forever. Phil's only chance would had been for at least half of those projects to break even once they launched and they didnt even do that.
Re: Xbox CEO Sets Ambitious Goal Of Reaching 'More Than A Billion People Each Day'
I think a lot of people are taking this to mean something that was not stated. When Asha wants to reach 1 billion daily users, she is talking of all current and future xbox segments.
This means mobile games (king), pc games, xbox console games (regardless of who publishes them, it's about them buying/renting/whatever from Xbox's store) TV Shows (like fallout) and movies (again, selling them and having you watch them on an Xbox client).
Asha also has a background on Meta/Facebook, FB has over 5 billion daily users. I would not be shocked if Asha attempts to expand Xbox live beyond gaming and into a social media platform of its own.
It also should say a lot that she wants King and Mojang will report directly to her and called Candy Crush and Minecraft platforms in and onto themselves.
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@Coletrain If it was NOT working, the studios that got divested from would had been shut down 4 years ago. They were producing nothing for too long. GP literally financed those titles. It was working, it was those studios that were just eating all the allowance by not just taking too long to deliver anything but also having their end products not be market-viable (at least not considering the resources tossed at them.)
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@FatGuyInLilCoat Just a note: Xbox One users can find plenty of value on all GP tiers. There is a large catalog of XBox one games there to play natively, and they also get access to XSX games via streaming from the comfort of a console's ergonomic (TV/Couch/Controller).
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@themightyant I think it would "survive", but it would become a shadow of itself if it loses the revenue stream to justify securing third party deals. At minimal scale, GP would be forced to only add a few small indies and exclusively rely on first party offerings to re-grow.
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@Coletrain
Wanted to touch on this bit: the problem with CoD is that it was a massive acquisition. It's a game they expected to make GP grow. Problem with that plan was that anyone buying CoD was already certainly subscribed to either GP Core or GPU to even be able to play online (unless it was a rare "just want the campaign" CoD player).
The point with all this is that as soon as CoD got added to GPU, at most, it got some GPExtra and GPCore members upgrade to GPU for minimal boost in revenue. They got a few new users to hop into GP on PC for the first time but that likely did not justify the losses in sales from the previous status quo.
Point being, it's not the same to add a brand-new game to a service as part of its value as it is to eliminate an existing revenue line to justify that service's value UNLESS you can make that result in giantic service growth, something that was virtually impossible to happen.
THAT, is, IMO, why CoD addition to GP did not really math-out. It's not an issue with any other new titles being added to the service. It IS an issue for something that people have requested for a long time though: Adding WoW subscription as a GP perk. That wont ever work out.
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@Coletrain I can see them feeling making GP any cheaper is not going to work financially for them, even if the player sticks for a full year. But that's where they could had use the lock-in as a means to mitigate the price hike.
In fact, I would dare say that Asha perhaps should had considered offering a 240 yearly sub as an alternative to removing CoD and lowering the per-month price.
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@themightyant
Agree with all of this.
Dont entirely agree with this though. Yes, most services like Netflix indeed ONLY work at scale, but GP is different. Netflix only sells their subscription. If they spend 100 million on a show, they expect enough subscribers to cover the cost as that's the only way to justify it. Xbox sells their game in addition to adding them to the service. So they are not as reliant on scale as others.
It still is a failure to have messed up the growth but not because it becomes unsustainable. Instead it's because that growth is a backbone to the core of Xbox. GP subs dont just increase the bottom line, they also lock in players into the ecosystem (be it Xbox consoles or Xbox app on PC) and from there those users are more likely to buy third party products.
So yes, devastating to their strategy but it's not as critical for it to work at massive scale as it is for the likes of Disney+ and Netfllix.
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
@Mincey0
If you read the article, it also states the trend changed with the recent price reductions. People dropping is not a trend, people dropping due to the price hike just caused a devastating blow to their progress.
Re: Xbox Game Pass Reportedly Drops To 30M Subscribers, But Has 'Started To Grow Again'
I don't subscribe to GP myself (well, I do have the essential tier for online multiplayer that I only use in FFXIV). I want a game, I tend to buy it. I used to be subscribed when the cost were low enough that it did not bother me "wasting" most months of the year.
IMO, Premium is the best value subscription. Especially for a new customer that instantly gets access to a gigantic back catalog. I just wish they were more predictable. I think EAPlay puts all their games exactly 12 months after launch. GP Premium is "sometime within 12 months". Even if sometimes that is better, I would prefer predictability.
As for tiers, controversial take:
GPU price hike was itself not the problem, but it was very poorly thought out. The hike was aimed at the group of people that only subscribe for one or two months to play a big new title and then drop out. The smart solution would had been for GPU to go to 30 BUT offer a year option where the player commits to the 12 months for a decent discount that net no hike from the old model (20 a month).
For me, 20 is still to high to subscribe and forget, but I'm sure they would had faced fewer unsubscribers and continued growth. As it stands, they set themselves back several years on their growth goals.
Re: Roundup: The First Reviews Have Arrived For AC Black Flag Resynced
I ended up preordering it and cant wait to get off work tomorrow. Hopefully its fully installed by the time I get home.
The reviews changed nothing since I was already all in, plus I got it on xbox that has about as good a return policy as Steam so had I been desatisfied within an hour I could get my money back. I don't expect to, though.
I played this game twice. 100% everything and got all Single Player achievements on Xbox and am only missing 2 sp Trophies on PS4. Are this game's online servers even on anymore? I sometimes feel tempted to revisit it and finallly get those too even if it's a grind because I just like the game that much.
I really hope they take this further and do AC3 next, because modern tech migh allow them to finally make the battle segments a lot more fun by actually having hundreads of NPCs battling on screen.
Re: AC Black Flag Resynced Comparison Shows Difference Between Xbox Series X And Series S
@TDHorizon I can partially understand the desire for unique landmark/loot reward, but all I care is for the activity itself. Be it figuing out how to reach a hard to grab collectible, complete some puzzle or complete a fight. For me, the reward is the content itself.
Executing and clearing those objectives, for me, is just fun on and of itself enough to justify them being there.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@themightyant I work in a HUGE shop. I know sometimes/often the layers are necessary. No one can effectively micro-manage 100 creative professionals effectively by themselves, management trees are needed to be more effective.
Of course the 14 layers was not universal. I am nearly certain it was primarily/deeper in ABK and Bethesda, that were brought in yet had minimal structural adjustments.
I'm still certain a lot of those layers were unecesary redundancies. And as much as I will go to the grave defending Phil (Xbox would no longer even exist without his contributions) I also think he hated doing many management things and just created additional layers to avoid doing so and "give studios creative freedom".
[stopping my posting here, got stuff to get done]
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@Banjo- I'm not going to say I like it. Honestly I don't, she could handle things a lot more tactfully and still get similar results, she is going to get a bad rap soon and people will likely end up seeing her as a grim ripper.
I also know people that work inside Xbox Games Studios (I wont elaborate), and they in turn know people and have family. I am not happy one bit about any of this.
I do know for sure this could have been way way worse than its being. It sucks, big time, but it could had been so much worse and am sure many were preparing for that even worse case scenario.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@themightyant 5% of the gross revenue is not cheap for a publisher that is struggling to reach at least a 15% profit margin and already has internal engines (they are not saving on developing one).
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@themightyant I think part of what got us here is that Phil bought these studios, integrated them into Microsoft Proper, but let them behave as independent subsidiaries (why they likely ended with 14 layers of management).
Only that an independent subsidiary usually needs to be a lot more careful about their own finances, Xbox just let them forget about the money and let them do whatever they wanted passing the bill up to MS when GP revenue would not cover it.
As for Halo, I have serious doubt Halo "6" development has even started in ernest, but that's just me being an extreme cynic and finding recently that State of Decay 3 didn't really start development until 2025 despite its 2020 reveal.
Edit: and yes, we been clearly told that anything that was the plan before is no longer the plan.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@Markatron84 Mostly said that becaus the rumors had been going on for a LONG time (supposedly the canned Battle Royale mode for Infinity was going to be done in Unreal and there were even rumors of a full Unreal transition for Infinite post launch).
But I'll stand corrected that it was an official statement and no longer just a rummor.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@Banjo- Agree. Still it IS annoying that it sounds they were just fired without being given a "do you want to relocate under the IW8 team?" even if that came with physical relocation requirements.
(again, this is only if it is indeed the reason, but I cant see any other reason to kill idTech than to reduce redundancy)
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@Markatron84 That was 2024. We now have new management, new direction, new philosophy [again].
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@Fiendish-Beaver
Anyone with long term memory that can remember my posting knows I have not been a fan of Asha from the get go and I have been very critical of many of her calls so far.
I know you are not specifically talking about me, but you might be including me under the umbrella. What I am doing is literally thinking for myself and trying to actually resolve what logic Asha is using.
I also stated this in Push Square: if I am right I still feel these coders should had been given a chance to move to the IW8 development team instead of just being fired. Depreciating the engine and removing redundancies is one thing, getting rid of solid talent that can help a potential "Xbox Engine" is something I still find like a cruel waste.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@themightyant That's what I am expecting, for the unreal plans to change again. Unreal is not a cheap engine and really can eat on revenues of larger titles. It can be cheap/free for indies but AAA titles likely pay huge slices of their revenue to Unreal for the convenience of using their pre-packaged product.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@Fiendish-Beaver If I understand the bits we are putting together from multiple articles, these are not "only coders", but specifically idTech coders, not game logic coders.
There might be some there, as well as others (it was not JUST coders) but it does really sound as the bulk was the team in charge of maintaining and developing the idTech engine.
There are certainly still coders that focus on content and mission scripting still there, and idTech sharing a root with IW8 might minimize any training overheads relative to a brand new engine.
Everyone: Do keep in mind that my talks about IW8 taking over at Xbox is just a theory based on a likely cold corporate view of reducing redundancies AND licensing fees of third party engines.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@xboxjapanfan If my theory is correct, expect a very similar news from Halo studios soon. Although I think their engine team might had already been disolved under Phil.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
@Banjo- @Markatron84 That's port was done by a separate studio (think outsourced) and so was the talks and rumors about halo using Unreal in the future.
I think since Asha's appointment they are looking to reduce costs and that likely includes minimizing unecesary license overheads of Unreal Engine. Hell I would not be shocked if whatever next entry is done for Gears (be it Gear's 6 or Emergence Day 2 or whatever) is mandated to be done using IW8.
I think Asha is a lot more financially driven than previous management and is unlikely to be swayed by "but this engine is key to the feel of the game", especially if they are forced to pay a third party for it's use.
Plus: Unreal has been getting worse over time and the promises of UE5 at the start of the generation have not really materialized. The only benefit for UE was that it was easier to hire talent for, especially given some annoying hiring policies enforced by upper management at MS on how long they can maintain a contract for. That forced them to lose contractors that spent months training on inshouse tools, and Phil likely hoped switching to Unreal would remove the training barrier.
Asha has so far managed to get some more breathing room from upper MS management so long she does what she been tasked, so maybe she can change that policy if only within Xbox.
Re: Xbox Layoffs Cut id Software In Half As DOOM: The Dark Ages DLC Launches
Not justifying this, this stucks and that cant be ignored.
I do think I see whats going on here, though. Push Square noted most of the members let go here were coders likely maintaining idTech. After all it's aquisitions, Xbox has at least 3 engines that are being used exactly for the same goal: FPS (Slipspace Engine for Halo, idTech for Doom/Wolfenstein, IW8 for Call of Duty).
Add to that the fact that IW8 was an evolution of idTech 3.
It sort of makes sense that they might opt to cut on that department and mandate that future entries of halo, id and machine games all start using the same engines Call of Duty uses.
Re: Compulsion Games, Double Fine & Undead Labs Issue Xbox Departure Statements
@Banjo- Even if they didnt perform as expected, they were still games published by Xbox and added to the GP library under the whole promisse of first party games going there. It might not be a great consumer pitch if they end up getting removed.
It was previous management, but are cuphead and Ori games still there despite Xbox letting those studios self publish their games on other platforms?
Re: Compulsion Games, Double Fine & Undead Labs Issue Xbox Departure Statements
@Banjo- It's hard to tell. MS might be willing to just release the publishing deals but a reason many publishing deals expire is they tend to have clauses that rights revert to the IP owner should publication go idle for a specific amount of time. In the day of physical media (books, movie, games) that was way more likely.
In the digital era, its virtually impossible for a publishing contract to expire unless there is a hard date because the media is almost always being actively published digitally. A hard date might be there, we likely wont ever really know since those contracts are always kept secret.
Re: Compulsion Games, Double Fine & Undead Labs Issue Xbox Departure Statements
@Banjo- I'm not sure if they own the games, but even if they did, most those games publishing rihghts are already locked with Xbox Game Publishing and that publishing contract likely does not have an expiration date. Does not mean they wont let them find a new publisher to release the game in some new platform if they want, but at the end of the day the publishing rights can be more important than game ownership itself.
Like, Obsidian and Outer Worlds. Even with Xbox owning the IP and game, they cant really do anything with Outer Worlds 1 because the publishing rights for that one belong to Private Division (Take Two).
Re: Compulsion Games, Double Fine & Undead Labs Issue Xbox Departure Statements
@GoldenPants There is likely some hooks. Like: you get the IP but we get first dibs on publishing anything you make for the next X years, also dibs for GamePass inclusion.
Outside that, MS either gets money (for the studios they sold) or get to write off the cost of the studos for the ones they divested from.
Re: AC Black Flag Resynced Comparison Shows Difference Between Xbox Series X And Series S
@Rangers420 Same. Those are two of my favoirte series, not just from Ubisoft from from all gaming.
Re: AC Black Flag Resynced Comparison Shows Difference Between Xbox Series X And Series S
@Rangers420 I appreciate the graphics but I love their games for the gameplay. I never understood the people that just cant accept not every game style is for them. Ubisoft "formula" games are my favorite style of game and they make them better than anyone else IMO.
And say what anyone whants: the whole industry is just copying the formula left and right because it's good! Anyone that insists Sony's Spider-Man, Horizon Zero Dawn, Ghost of Tsushima and all these modern open world are not just Ubisoft Formula games under a different publishing banner are just in denial.
Re: AC Black Flag Resynced Comparison Shows Difference Between Xbox Series X And Series S
I know these comparisons get lots of attention but, outside of making the owners of higher end hardware feel better about their investment, I don't understand the point.
All versions really seem to look and play great. Yes there are differences but someone that owns a Series S is likely already used to the quality that comes with the hardware they play on.
There are very few games where the lower end hardware really results in a horrible experience, and those end up being the only cases I find these useful. Having one done for nearly every major game, makes it that more harder to highlight those cases.
Anyways rant aside, really looking forward to playing this! I ended up preordering and I don't work Friday so going to dive in as soon as I get home Thursday!
Re: Compulsion Games, Double Fine & Undead Labs Issue Xbox Departure Statements
So far this is the best bit of news from all of these. Instead of risking being axed by some corporation, all these studios seem to be given a chance at carving their own future and succeeding or failing on their own terms.
I for one really hope Compulsion Games specifically takes advantage of existing IPs they still own and don't jump into a brand new project. They have tons of assets they can create sequels with, allowing for lower budget production and quicker turnaround should they manage themselves wisely. If they follow that path, they dont need millions of sales to justify the games budgets, and slowly get themselves afloat.
I really really want a sequel to South of Midnight, I don't care for any gameplay flaws. They can polish that and give us more of that gorgeous world.
Ninja Theory seems to have learned that lesson with the new Hellblade game. It's turnaround is so quick they likely are doing a lot of asset reuse, while also addressing some of the biggest consumer concerns and making a more action focused game in that same setting.
I also hope Xbox keeps friendly relationship and offers them Game Pass deals that help them fund their cycles.
Re: Report: Bethesda Faces 'Significant Overhaul' At Xbox, Will Focus On Key Franchises
General reply to many comments: the reason we seem to get these games (Fallout/ElderScrolls/Starfield) so far in between eachother is that with the exception of New Vegas, Todd seems to insist being the one leading the core development of every new entry in these games. No Todd, no new Fallout, Elder Scroll or Starfield.
Elder Scrolls 6 was not being worked on in parallel with Starfield. It was just teased but actual production didn't start until Starfield launch.
That's something Asha should definitively force a change on. Like, literally the only one of these entries that was not touched by Todd is the most beloved Fallout entry to date. And most of these games are also good not because the core game was good, but because the DLC make them what they became. DLC AND community mods.
Todd is a talented developer, but he is a single man and cant keep holding the flow so much. He needs to either be more high level supervisor or at least accept other teams working on some of their IPs while he focuses on his primary project.
Re: Report: Bethesda Faces 'Significant Overhaul' At Xbox, Will Focus On Key Franchises
So.... we getting new Quake and and Wolfenstein games, got it!
Re: Xbox Announces 3,200 Job Cuts And Four Studio Departures
@PartyMarty It's still bad, at most those studios are likely 400 or 500 (and the 500 is me stretching it) so thats still a lot of job losses.
I only want to be pragmatic, not to cover the sky with my hand. This whole thing sucks, as much as its important to recognize this is far from the worst case scenario.
Re: Xbox Announces 3,200 Job Cuts And Four Studio Departures
@Banjo-
IF these cuts are indeed primarily to management positions [the ones responsible to keep projects in track and obviously didn't] and not the actual workforce... it still sucks because its still people losing their jobs on a terrible economy, but it's more bearable than the end coders/artists/designers/etc being the ones that get cut off.
Re: Xbox Announces 3,200 Job Cuts And Four Studio Departures
@Fiendish-Beaver "Some of the games or studios could well have been under consideration for cancellation or closure"
Thing is: it likely was considered but they also considered options. In fact, it seemed they went out of their way to make cancelations and shutdowns the absolute last alternative.
Some other publishers never consider such options and just shut things down entirely. The news is bad, and that should not be ignored, but the fact that its being handled this way in an industry that trends towards just shutting studios down and tossing IPs into a vault should also be aknowledged.
Re: Xbox Announces 3,200 Job Cuts And Four Studio Departures
Am I the only one that was expecting Xbox to shut down these studios AND fire 5,000 people? I partially dont think I am since PushSquare is trying to push that its actually 4,800 firings.
They are adding up today's 1,600 with the total 3,200 number as if they are two separate waves despite Asha clearly saying the other 1,600 jobs will be eliminated through the fiscal year (for the 3,200 total).
Re: Rumour: Xbox Still Evaluating Whether Project Helix Will Support Physical Discs
At this point it would be stupid for Xbox not to offer a disk drive, even is as an attachment. PlayStation literally tossed the ball at xbox's feet and they have a chance to score big by offering it at least as an option.
Re: Xbox Announces 3,200 Job Losses And Four Studio Departures
According to wikipedia:
Ninja Theory - 120 employees (as of 2020)
Compulsion Games - 80 (as of 2021)
Double Fine - 105 (as of 2025)
Undead Labs - 60 (as of 2018)
Some of these are very old numbers and likely a bit lower than they are today but doubt any are smaller. Still also doubt any are double their last reported size. Even with a generous 10% staff boost, we would only be looking at roughly 400 jobs out of that 3200 not being firings or retirements. That still likely means 2800 people no longer have a job, and we have no way to know of those how many might be retirements.
At the end, this news is bad, but this is not the news PlayStation was likely hoping to take the heat away from their physical games heat.
Re: Xbox Announces 3,200 Job Losses And Four Studio Departures
@datamonkey
Timelines. Those studios were bought when xbox was starting to expand, running on a much more limited budget and trying to prove itself to upper management with GamePass. They did not have the exec favor at that point to get a green light on acquiring anything larger than these studios.