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Topic: General Xbox Series X Thread

Posts 721 to 735 of 735

S1ayeR74

I have a question, I’ve got a Sony AG9 55” OLED 4K. It’s HDMI 2, don’t think it has Vsync? It doesn’t have VRR, so if I get a Series X are the games going to be screen tearing in it all the time, like in the Digital Foundry Valhalla gameplay video? Or will it be down to the developers to fix it so it doesn’t?

S1ayeR74

Krzzystuff

@S1ayeR74 it will be developer based. I don't have HDR or VRR on my TV and my games look fantastic. Haven't played Valhalla though so it would likely have issues like everyone has been reporting without VRR.

Krzzystuff

NEStalgia

@BAMozzy I think that's overthinking it, and the last paragraph is correct. Valhalla has been in development for quite a few years, since long before the new consoles existed. Any current game has. It is an X1X game with some tweaks for the new machines. So is Yakuza. For that matter so are Miles, Souls, and Horizon FW PS4 games with some tweaks.

But despite that there's still the issue that it's performing slightly better on PS5, while performing fairly awful, really, on both machines and you would think the hardware advantage would go to XSX if only because the design would benefit from X1X being an original target vs. Pro.

I can't remember if you've been on the Push Square conversations, but there's two users there, primarily one, who are devs, that sound pretty high level, although anonymous. The most vocal of the 2 has worked multiplat primarily on the PS side of AAA's, and has worked Sony first party - so there's going to be bias there - and working on the Sony port side of things, the grapevine will also show bias. But in contexts like this, it's a useful bias for information. The things they've been hearing (combined with experience) are basically that the PS5 dev kit is simply easy to use, as in less effort is required to get a particular result or optimization, the hardware and kit are simply automating more things that have to be done with more manual effort for XB. It's not so much that the XB kit can't achieve the same result, but that it takes more effort into it to do. And the other thing that's not bias was that the analysts are telling the AAAs (the big publishers) that PS5 will outsell XB considerably, and as a result they are putting their focus 250% on PS5 in terms of effort and expense. As you say, it depends on the utility of other platforms from MS and how much it crosses over in effort, and what those install bases are. But currently we have a situation where we know PS outsells XB, publishers know that, analysts are confirming that (think Patcher and friends), and the result out of the board room is "XB doesn't matter much to the bottom line, just work on the PS version mostly, and make sure the XB one is ok-ish."

None of that means the PS5 is better hardware, of course. But I'm getting the picture the PS5 is designed to allow "quick & lazy" development efforts to yield an optimal result. And combined with their marketing power and anticipated install numbers the devs know they can hit their biggest market with the least effort. That's no doubt not an accident on Sony's part. MS's hardware has more potential overall, but it requires more effort to take use of, to reach a smaller audience, unless that effort is going to pay off for a huge install base across the platforms of MS. MS's goal then has to be to ensure/demonstrate that the same optimization effort is required for PC, XB, and xCloud all at once. And that they have the install numbers combined to justify it. And to help out with getting these big engines optimized where needed.

The only part that confuses me is I'd still expect the XSX to outperform the PS5 with these early crossover games from the old gen. Even those PS-focused devs expected that, actually....so Ubi's result here is an extraordinarily confusing mess of a game....but don't we expect that from Ubi?

NEStalgia

NEStalgia

@S1ayeR74 Depends if the game runs like garbage with unstable framerates or if it runs at a reasonable framerate. Valhalla runs like garbage on both platforms. Few people have screens with VRR, 120, etc. - HDMI 2.1 Only last year's absolute top of the line TVs have that stuff. 95% of the gaming public doesn't have one. Probably only 50% will by the end of the gen.

Heck, my monitor doesn't support VRR but does support Freesync which XB supports. But I can't use it because Freesync doesn't go through my HDMI switches, I'd have to connect directly to the screen, and that won't happen since I need audio breakout and need to manage multiple consoles.

NEStalgia

ReddMcKnight

I didn't want to make a new thread for this single question, since this thread seems appropriate. So...

Is there a way I can use my USA GamerTag to browse the Japan Marketplace and thus, purchase a Japan Exclusive game? I would just buy a disc, but there doesn't seem to be one for this game, Kunio-Kun World Classics.

ReddMcKnight

JGRockford

Ok, I've done this as an Australian, buying US games not available in Australia.

Sky Force and Hotline Miami collection, both unavailable in Australia.

Unsure about the case of Japan, but if you are able to find a XBox gift card (to redeem it's code) for that region (try Play-Asia). Do not try the redeem page on Microsoft's website.

Next, go to the product page on Microsoft's site, not on XBox.

Click buy, and use your gift card as your method of payment.

I hear this might also work with a Japanese based CC, but have not tested.

Note, the above is different to redeeming a product code that is not on your own region's store, as I've found to be problematic.

Though, through the use of VPN, I've purchased UK and US codes (as an Australian), and redeemed product codes that are available to my own region's store.

Hoping this helps 💜

Edited on by JGRockford

JGRockford

S1ayeR74

Krzzystuff wrote:

@S1ayeR74 it will be developer based. I don't have HDR or VRR on my TV and my games look fantastic. Haven't played Valhalla though so it would likely have issues like everyone has been reporting without VRR.

NEStalgia wrote:

@S1ayeR74 Depends if the game runs like garbage with unstable framerates or if it runs at a reasonable framerate. Valhalla runs like garbage on both platforms. Few people have screens with VRR, 120, etc. - HDMI 2.1 Only last year's absolute top of the line TVs have that stuff. 95% of the gaming public doesn't have one. Probably only 50% will by the end of the gen.

Heck, my monitor doesn't support VRR but does support Freesync which XB supports. But I can't use it because Freesync doesn't go through my HDMI switches, I'd have to connect directly to the screen, and that won't happen since I need audio breakout and need to manage multiple consoles.

Cool, that was my worry, but still I hope devs don’t rely on VRR to fix the issues and make the software work properly. Thanks for the replies

S1ayeR74

JGRockford

Pound for pound in optimised conditions, XBox wins.

But these developers aren't utilising all the tools at their disposal at this time.

Dropping this here:

Edit:

This was in reply to a discount troll, who was largely ignorant of any facts. Not directed to Senua, who I do appreciate being here 🤗

Edited on by JGRockford

JGRockford

BAMozzy

Its clear that BOTH consoles are not being fully utilised yet and both are likely to see updates too. You have to remember that circumstances are completely different to any other launch and for developers too. People are not able to access SDK's (Software Development Kits) and pressured to bring Software to Hardware that they have little/no experience of. MS have changed a LOT with their new DX12 Ultimate which in itself isn't officially released yet and some studio's still haven't got the latest SDK. Both of which present issues for developers and optimising their games for the Series consoles.

There is no way that the difference in clock speed is enough to make up for a large deficit in Shaders (all things being 'equal'). If you 'boost' a much smaller GPU, it won't suddenly perform better than a much larger, already 'fast' GPU with 20% more computational power. Digital Foundry found that a 'faster' RX5700 (36CU's), boosted to match the RX 5700 XT (40CU's) in terms of TFlops, the 5700XT still outperformed the faster 5700. Admittedly, the boost wasn't as significant and the difference in shaders was much closer - but the point is, the 'speed' of Sony's GPU isn't enough to match the sheer difference in size. Its like having two offices of printers - one with 2304 printers each printing 2230 sheets an hour, compared to 3328 printers each printing 1825 sheets an hour - the faster but fewer printers are still only printing a lot less sheets per hour. That's what you have with these two consoles - assuming each is 'equal'. Of course, in reality each shader can do two operations per cycle (like a printer printing 2 simultaneous sheets) - which if you do the maths (2304 x 2 x 2230 & 3328 x 2 x 1825), you will get the TF of both Consoles. Yes the speed may allow a few things to be better, having extra 'cycles' per frame, but in the history of GPU's, the smaller GPU's in the same family do not beat a much larger GPU with significantly higher 'performance' by overclocking. You couldn't for example take an RTX 3070 and overclock to 2230Mhz (if that was possible) and its suddenly going to beat an RTX 3090 at 1825 - forget the VRAM differences, the difference in shaders (Cuda Cores) would still leave the 3070 trailing...

Not all things are equal and never will be - Sony won't be using DX12 Ultimate API for a start and devs have had more experience with Sony's SDK and development suite as its also similar to PS4's development suite. There are differences built into the GPU too and pipeline so we will have to see what happens in the long term with BOTH systems but right now BOTH are not running fully optimised with full features available - BOTH will get updates and improvements, developers will get more used to EACH and get much more out of the Hardware - especially as they start to develop new games with the new hardware as the 'lead' design. Games like AC:V and Dirt 5 were developed for Current Gen, AC:V started development over 3yrs ago...

I have played over 50hrs in AC:Valhalla and yes, its not 'perfect' in terms of performance but I am really enjoying it so far. I expect it to be 'improved' but I wouldn't be surprised if its still better than playing on an XB1X (I haven't tried).

A pessimist is just an optimist with experience!

Why can't life be like gaming? Why can't I restart from an earlier checkpoint??

Feel free to add me but please send a message so I know where you know me from...

Xbox Gamertag: bamozzy

mousieone

@BAMozzy so basically Covid strikes again but no one wants to hear that. And also cross gen always have hiccups. Thanks BAM

mousieone

BAMozzy

@mousieone There has never been a Launch in similar circumstances and many areas have been severely impacted by Covid. A lot of Devs maybe able to work from home, but they cannot access SDK's from home, have to communicate and send files to others and wait for them to report back rather than be able to see the data or impact themselves - all whilst struggling with the current situation, maybe with friends/family suffering with the effects, or dealing with loss.

Officially, I don't think DX12 Ultimate is released yet either. Not only have developers not got access to SDK's, they also haven't got access to the API's to take advantage of a lot of the features that would help to optimise games for the new hardware. MS were later at getting out SDK's to studio's and some were certainly not final spec - waiting on AMD and RDNA2.0.

A lot of cross gen games in the past really didn't do a lot more than just boost the resolution. A lot of the visual settings are the same. Also they only had 2 generations, 2 specs to worry about per 'family'. On Playstation, they have 3 (PS4, Pro and PS5) and on Xbox, they have 4 different specs to optimise for (XB1, XB1X, Series S and Series X) as well as PC and in a lot of cases, Stadia too. Most games at the start of last gen only released on 5 platforms - PS3, PS4, XB360, XB1 and PC. Also didn't have a global pandemic ongoing with Governments changing the rules every week. When devs/publishers set a release date, they may base that on having their offices open - albeit on a reduced staffing level for 'Social Distancing' but then the Government decides to go into Lockdown for all but non-essential businesses and force those devs to work from home with little/no access to the hardware they are supposed to be optimising for.

Patches too have to be passed by platform holders as well so they have to wait for MS/Sony to allow them to update - again takes time if they are not able to verify the patches as they are not in the office either...

Its a crazy world right now so lets just give them the benefit of doubt and more time to put things right. Its crazy to expect them to get things 'right' with the current situation and conditions they are trying to work with and around to get games released. A lot of the games were certainly not built with current consoles and haven't necessarily got access to the right tools to optimise them, take advantage of the features etc so to expect them to suddenly be 'next gen' with at most, the minor issues we have normally had is unrealistic. I obviously hope they can update their games sooner rather than later but I am willing to give them a lot more leeway than normal with the current state of the world.

A pessimist is just an optimist with experience!

Why can't life be like gaming? Why can't I restart from an earlier checkpoint??

Feel free to add me but please send a message so I know where you know me from...

Xbox Gamertag: bamozzy

graysoncharles

My local best buy had series x and s freshly out of the oven today. The x were swiftly taken, while there are still a lot of series s lying around 😂

graysoncharles

ReddMcKnight

By any chance, has anyone taken a whack at Dynasty Warriors 8 Empires on the Series X yet? I recall it consistently crashing/freezing on the Xbox One systems, so I'm curious if it was ever fixed, or if it just works right on the Series X.

ReddMcKnight

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