Talking Point: It's Been A Year Since Phil Spencer Announced The 'Xbox Business Update' Event

It's all good giving away what made xbox special, Giving playstation the what would be the sales of xbox consoles. But what do we get in return? The possibility of xbox console sales dropping even more and no ps games coming over... Horrid buisness model.

The amount of lies we were told back then is honestly infuriating, all the ports being announced right now were already greenlit when Phil was saying on camera “it’s only 4 games”.

And btw, a bit off topic, there’s a growing scarcity of Xbox consoles globally, it’s become hard to get on basically every market outside the US, there’s many threads such as this one already and it’s looking as Microsoft already gave up on hardware. https://www.reddit.com/r/xbox/s/u8xVJPGq1j

Oh god, I didn't consider all the anniversary articles for this non news cycle. It's already basically a copy paste article and comment section whenever a new(old) game is announced for another storefront or when someone at xbox repeats the same case by case, no red lines messaging.

I miss the daily Abk articles. Those "Fiji gov approves deal" or " xbox exec wishes it was closed already" headlines seem way more informative.

@DeanyBabyy What Microsoft got, and will get, is an additional revenue stream that has resulted in good money for what could be considered their lesser titles. Wait until Halo/Gears hits PS/Nintendo. It's about making money, not selling plastic boxes and satisfying the few die hard. There are 3 billion gamers in the world, only about 70M own Xboxes. Go where the money is. Business 101, kids

The team revealed that Xbox Game Pass had hit a new user milestone...

Of course, what they didn't say was that that milestone was achieved through Gold being renamed/absorbed into Game Pass with the creation of Core. Clever management speak, and pretty much meaningless once the truth was realised.

It's the same with the recent talk about BO6 and Game Pass, where there was a spike in subscriptions with its inclusion, and yet the money coming in didn't match what they were saying. The really interesting statistics will be whether Game Pass retains those extra subs 3 or 6 months later, which is something I highly doubt...

I said back then, and many times since, anyone that thought it was only ever going to be those 4 games was deluded. Indeed, in an interview straight after the pod cast, Phil Spencer wasn't even able to deny that Starfield would also be ported, only sticking with the 'it's not one of the four' line. I remain convinced to this day that the four was going to be five, and that Starfield was one of them, but that the sudden furore surrounding the rumour of the game being ported to the PlayStation was enough to put them off at the time.

Starfield will be announced soon, I'm sure of it. Whether the Switch 2 is capable of running it, I have no idea, but I suspect that it is, and that when the Switch 2 has a proper showing we will see a real slew of Xbox games being announced for it and for the PlayStation. Indeed, it will be interesting to see the next couple of Nintendo showcases to see which Xbox games will be going over.

I did have to snigger to myself when I wondered whether Sony would ever pay for an exclusive made by a Microsoft studio. Can you imagine the uproar that would cause? Want to play the next Halo instalment? Buy a PlayStation...! 😂

From my perspective, apart from CoD, Doom and Minecraft, all other games have been 'exclusive' on Xbox. FH5 for example released in 2021 and will be nearly 4yrs old by the time it releases on PS5. Indiana Jones has been out 3 months already - quarter of a year.

There was a LOT of talk that Starfield would release on PS5 after a year - maybe with the release of the Shattered Space DLC.

It still seems like a very small percentage of games will be available 'Day 1' everywhere. But the vast majority are released 'exclusively' on Xbox Consoles - even if some will eventually be ported to Playstation. If you want to play these IP's 'first', or even 'Free' with a Sub service, the ONLY console worth buying is Xbox as you'll not know when (or even IF) MS will decide to release on Playstation.

I couldn't care less who else can play certain games - doesn't bother me that a Playstation gamer will soon be able to play AoE2, FH5, Indy, Doom etc. All that matters to me is where I can play the Games I want to and 'when'. I'd rather have the choice to play when its released 'first', not be kept hanging for months or even years for a port...

If we look at things calmly and without media confusion, there hasn't been a major change, just a slow evolution. They ported 4 exclusive games, and now we know that Indiana Jones, Forza Horizon 5, Age of Empires and Retold will be ported, 4 more games, including 3 service games that are over 4 years old. I wouldn't call it a complete shift, but a continuation of the announced case-by-case strategy, and common sense for GAAS games.

The multiplatform games that have brought in money are mostly those that were already multiplatform, starting with Call of Duty. Same for Doom, the game was already multiplatform; it doesn't result from a strategy change for those games.

At the same time, we have had exclusive games like Stalker 2, Flight Simulator, Hellblade 2, Ara: History Untold, Indiana Jones (timed exclusive), Dungeons of Hinterberg, and I forget some, then Avowed, South of Midnight, and others will follow.

The production of Xbox games is such that they are always one step ahead, and the balance of exclusive games vs. multiplatform games remains in favor of exclusive games, even if some are temporary. At the same time, who wants to play a game 4 years later? It's like Forza Horizon 5, the game has done its job, and Forza Horizon 6 will soon be announced, which will be released 4 years later on PS. Those who haven't understood this greatly underestimate Xbox's strategy.

One thing I never see mentioned and i’m not sure if it’s because i’m forgetting something but - I blame Deathloop. That would have been their first proper taste of a Playstation launch for a new game (outside of Minecraft right? Can’t really count that as it’s next level). They must have liked it.

@fatpunkslim we are only getting exclusives at the moment due to time-lag. Once they catch up there will be zero exclusives outside of the odd indie game that needs a slow rollout. And of course any legacy titles like Redfall, delisted Forza Horizons and maybe Rare Replay.

Keep exclusives one year on the Xbox platforms and then port it to other consoles:

Win:Win.

My beef is how dishonest they were back then. “Just four games, not a change to our kind of fundamental exclusive strategy” and “I don’t want to create a false expectation that the dam is opening and then everything else is coming”. Just look how poorly those quotes have aged in such little time. Two weeks ago we had Phil saying “there's no reason for me to put a ring fence around any game and say this game will not go to a place where it would find players, where it would have business success for us”. They knew exactly what they were doing back then and they deliberately downplayed the change in strategy and have gradually shifted the goalposts ever since in subsequent interviews.

I’ve made peace with the change (though my concerns about the potential impacts on future hardware remain), but I haven’t made peace with Xbox leadership deliberately hiding their true intentions back then and downplaying it so much. As a customer I want honesty and certainty above all else. The constant daily articles speculating about this game and that game are exhausting and it’s all Xbox’s fault for not communicating properly. They continue this irritating policy of deliberate ambiguity rather than just being honest and upfront by admitting that Halo, Gears, Fable etc. will all be multi-console franchises going forwards.

@IOI - that’s very interesting. I’m not particularly bothered about what games are playable where but I do hope Xbox continues as a platform. It is pretty odd if there’s a shortage of Xbox hardware worldwide as seems to be the case.

If Microsoft do want to exit hardware and go third-party then I can’t fathom what the plan is with Gamepass or everyone’s (Xbox) digital libraries? Got to be something else on Microsoft’s agenda, I just can’t work out what.

@fatpunkslim lack of knowledge? I’m aware Sony signed the exclusivity deal. Hence the point of it releasing first on Playstation (like I said). Xbox was in the acquisition process at the time. They honoured the 1 year deal. You think they don’t have optics on the financials from that deal? But thanks for the insult 👍

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/xbox-says-it-will-honour-ps5-exclusivity-agreements-for-deathloop-and-ghostwire/

@omno it launched in September 2021. Bethesda finally joined Microsoft in March 2021.

@IOI I agree, that’s the most frustrating part about all of this and it’s made me very resentful to Xbox leadership. How can I trust what they say when I have seen how badly their claims only 12 months previously have aged? The PS5 versions of Forza Horizon 5, Indiana Jones, Doom TDA, The Outer Worlds 2, Age of Empires etc. would have taken far more than just a few months to cobble together. This was all fully in motion when this podcast aired and they deliberately lied by omission so as to downplay the changes.

@Cakefish yup the lies were ridiculous.

Especially the “if you’re on other platforms don’t take this as a sign that everything is coming, it’s not”. When it is.

And now Phil looks personally offended if you even suggest any sort of exclusivity to him.

@fatpunkslim Firstly, “two people” told me i’m wrong yet one of those 2 just said “let me correct what i’ve said”… ….

Secondly what are you even talking about? Xbox would have seen how Deathloop did on Playstation. They don’t usually get to see so much financial detail from games releasing on Playstation because it’s usually none of their business. However they would have seen the financials for Deathloop. That is all I said - how am I a troll? And I have no idea what you mean with your last sentence so okay 👍

@omno i’m aware of that. No one said it wasn’t. That isn’t the point. The game still released on Playstation under Microsoft’s ownership.

@fatpunkslim I brought up Deathloop. Literally my comment said no one else brings this up. I am speculating about Deathloop.

Literally came here to join in the discussion and now i’m a conspiracy theorist and a troll.

And I think Phil lied last year in the business update, if you don’t thats great.

I'm fine with everything he said, and I'm fine with all the moves Xbox has made this last year. It's only going to make them stronger. I'm not fine with the fact that it's been a whole year since this happened. Where does time go? O_o

@themightyant The massive returns was just Call Of Duty...lol
Which is what always happens with COD. It sells very well on PlayStation.

@K1LLEGAL Let's forget your speculation (yet another one) about Deathloop, which is irrelevant.

On what Phil said "“if you’re on other platforms don’t take this as a sign that everything is coming, it’s not”" you think its a lie and so, everything is going to other platforms", I disagree !

I think it's a binary and simplistic view of things, especially coming from a company worth billions. I believe their strategy is much more nuanced than that.

At least we know what we disagree on!

@omno I already explained that but apparently no one is reading my comments just trying to desperately fact-check me instead.

@fatpunkslim you disagree about the multiplatform stuff which is…. speculation. What the hell else is this comment section for? And you want to forget my comment about Deathloop which was my whole comment so I guess conversation over, shame.

@K1LLEGAL don't feed him dude. Utterly pointless with this one my friend.

@omno i’m not defensive - you joined the site an hour ago to try and correct something I said that didn’t need correcting. In fact this is your first reply that is actually engaging in the conversation. But ok I will try and relax. Thanks for the convo.

@Weebleman in hindsight yea - my bad.

Should have just called him a silly billy and moved on.

Even after all that SX is my fav console (even that I have ps5 pro). So if xbox prime is same as SX but more powerful thats enough for me already. Sign me up.
I keep PS and N for exclusives mostly. Prob utilize my ps5 pro until prime comes.
But if xbox hardware completely flops, I will look more into PC and potential Steam based PC as a main platform. Again we have to wait at least 5-7 years until this happens though.

Talking Point: It's Been A Year Since Phil Spencer Announced The 'Xbox Becoming Just Developer Update' Event.

Fixed it! Lol

No disrespect to author of article.

@K1LLEGAL I try and avoid the general porting discussions but I’m finding the backlash to your comment hilarious.

Microsoft buy Bethesda and immediately gain access to the companies entire financial history. They will have seen Deathloop performing well on PS and dollar signs would have formed in their eyes. It’s an excellent observation which, as you say most people probably haven’t considered. Especially with Deathloop being the first current gen only title from Bethesda, MS got their first real insight into exactly how much they could make porting games over.

I don't care about Microsoft's bottom line! They're giving away our exclusives while we get nothing back from Sony. Gran Turismo won't come to Xbox, but Xbox is happy to be cucked

@GeeEssEff thanks man. Even just for reading my comment. It was supposed to just be a fun speculation. Could be completely wrong, or could be on to something, but didn’t mean to upset anyone 🤣

Haven't they just lied about a lot of things in retrospect? They can just be open and transparent to better manage fan expectation. They have a strong brand and I want Xbox to do well but only if they continue to earn our trust rather than disappoint us or throw us into a niche they find to be unprofitable compared to other demographics.

@K1LLEGAL You make a good point but I don’t think Deathloop proved anything or was the catalyst, I think once they acquired ABK they took a look at their financials at how staggeringly more money is being made at PlayStation, specially for Call of Duty, and with the need of recouping those 80 billion spent for ABK and Zenimax, Microsoft just pivoted overnight leaving the Xbox division scrambling to even accept their new reality, what I’ll never be fine with is the blatant lies they repeatedly have said to people who have spent years and hundreds of dollars on building a library around some games we were told repeatedly would never be going to other consoles.

That’s why now I hesitate to spend any money on the Xbox store but just can’t sell my Xbox as I have 130+ games I can’t play anywhere else without having to buy them again, and now for whatever baffling reason there’s less options to buy a new console right now.

We're not saying it's aliens, but hey, it's aliens

I don't mind having games on PlayStation, but I fear that this will cause Xbox to lose its hardware presence and third parties will stop releasing games on Xbox.

In fact, many games were not released in areas like Japan where Xbox has no presence.

@Fiendish-Beaver just like they bragged about new subsidized gamepass members when they dropped Xbox Live. I was always subscribed to Xbox live but was forced to get GP just to play online. These marketing people love to do clever things as it’s their only job.

What you are forgetting, @BAMozzy, is that the roll out of games on PC was slow to start with due to the backlash the decision received.

Now, with a completely different mindset to that which Microsoft had back then, I imagine the period of time between a game being on the Xbox first and then the PC will be greatly accelerated. Going forward, I think there will be very few games that have an exclusivity period at all, but if they do that even fewer will have 12 months. At most I would image 3 to 6 months, but that will be replaced by day and date on both consoles within 2 years, by which time we will have become used to it, just as we did with PC.

The issue I have is that I believe that the decision to put games on the PC, is one of the reasons that the Xbox console has declined so drastically, and therefore it is highly, highly likely that putting games on the PlayStation will be the the final nail in the coffin that is the Xbox console...

@Fiendish-Beaver They had released a few games on PC over the years - some of which were 'PC' only games too - but since 2016's Forza Horizon 3 (I believe), The majority have been Day 1 on both Xbox and PC - a few were also PC first (Gears Tactics, MSFS, AoE4 etc).

The difference between PC and Playstation though is that Microsoft own 'Windows' and of course considers Microsoft Windows customers as part of their Microsoft ecosystem, they are Microsoft customers too - on Playstation, they are NOT and Sony will take a percentage of the revenue as its their 'ecosystem'.

Even if games were to release Day 1 on PS5, That doesn't automatically mean EVERY Xbox owner will abandon Xbox and switch to Playstation. You'll lose access to all the Digital games you own - even if they were released on PS. On Xbox, those games would likely remain in your Library. Game Pass too is not likely to be available on Playstation so it will be costly. Just in the next few months we have games like Doom, Avowed, South of Midnight etc coming out so the 'best' value way to play is still going to be on Xbox.

Maybe eventually they will release Day/Date with everything on Sony's Platform, but I doubt that will be for quite some time - just like Sony with their 'PC' releases. PC though is a Microsoft 'powered' device, those gamers are MS customers too.

Yep, so how is that "nothing burger" tasting that OhNoiIsAlexx and other shills served on to you all?

It is great to see people in here calling out the lies for exactly what they were though, no defending and changing goal posts, just raw honesty.

@themightyant And that would have been easily 75% in PS5'S favor had Indiana Jones actually launched on the console in December. Crazy numbers when you break it down.

Kingdom Come Deliverance 2 broke a million sales. Based on the 3rd party publisher Xbox's numbers, 750,000 of those sales are probably on PS5.

@Lrapsody Yeah, I'm hoping this might work both ways, but I'm not sure it will, it's hard to imagine seeing Gran Turismo on the XBOX. There's one game I'd like to see a version of on the XBOX though, and that is Resogun. That game was an addiction, I used to own a Vita many, many years ago, and I used to take it to work and play Resogun on my lunch break 🤣

Yes, @BAMozzy, I accept that a PC is a windows device, matey. However, where do the majority of Xbox games sell on the PC? Steam! Where, of course, Microsoft then pay Valve their 30% for the privilege. So I don't think that 30% will be a barrier to Microsoft looking to selling games on the PlayStation. Better to have 70% extra revenue, than no revenue at all...

@themightyant I would argue that they saw how much you make on PS5, not ALL platforms. If PlayStation did the same and brought their games to Xbox, they would see only a small 15% of extra sales only with PC making up the other 15% which they lose a large chunk of since they have to pay for the development and extra time it takes releasing on 2 awkward Xbox consoles.

Lego Horizon released on 3 platforms and one was Switch. It flopped. I'm most certainly not buying a game was built for Switch 1 first and is the complete opposite of cutting edge tech and visuals, something the Horizon series stands for (and there are better more advanced open world Lego games for years).
Going with more platforms does not equal instant better success. I hope Sony learned a big lesson here.

@K1LLEGAL Thats a really good point you make about Deathloop. Between Betheda and the ABK merger they are seeing just how much more they make on PS than they do on their own platform. When you factor in that they are last place for console sales, and that nearly all PC users use steam not a MS platform for games its a no brainer as what they gain selling everywhere vastly outweight any negatives or upset caused to their fanbase.

As for the other guy I would just ignore him in future as he insists on stating his opinions as fact, whilst telling everyone else their opinions are just that.

@Fiendish-Beaver Whilst I will agree that Steam may well be the most popular option for PC gamers, they still have a choice to buy from Microsoft and/or subscribe to Game Pass - Microsoft have their own Storefront and Service. They are still 'windows' games that are sold on Steam so its not like they have to 'port' it over to 'Steam OS'.

PC is an 'open' platform so has other 'sellers' - Epic is another for example. MS still has to 'compete' here too of course to get sales through their own store but also have Game Pass on PC too - something they won't have on Playstation. The fact PC may have competing retailer 'Platform' options doesn't mean its equatable to Xbox vs Playstation Console platform. They are all selling the exact same Software built for Windows PC - not a 'ported' to Steam OS, ported to Sony's or Nintendo's proprietary Hardware...

Agreed, @themightyant. I've been a member here for over 10 years, and have also been accused of being a troll before. Maybe it's a right of passage, @K1LLEGAL... 😂

@themightyant @Fiendish-Beaver haha I will get them eventually. Just waiting for the right time to come out from under the bridge.

@ilyn Yea I stepped away from the site for a bit so lost track of who is who. In the words of Phil Spencer; i’m “going to learn”.

MS has finally made Xbox profitable which it has not been for a while. Most of the games that MS is releasing for other consoles have been multiplayer games all of which hugely benefit from being cross platform. What MS needs to do with there next console is to improve the UI/backend to games so they are more capable of streaming.

@Fiendish-Beaver The current rumor is that Starfield will be announced for PS5 at the next Playstation State of Play.

@fatpunkslim That's a looooot of assuming. Just because Horizon 5 released 4 years later on PS5 doesn't mean that the same thing will happen wth Horizon 6. It could be a couple months like Indiana Jones. Flight Simulator is rumored to be on PS5 and Switch 2 too.

I've not seen that rumour, @Lanmanna, but I really wouldn't be shocked if that was the case...

4 games no promise beyond that